• Hardware
  • Acer V3-571G with 8bit IPS screen dithering is very bad, why?

Here goes.

I have V3-571G laptop. Screen is FHD 15.6" AUO B156HAN09.0 - € 130,10

You can see datasheet and specs here: https://www.twscreen.com/en/lcdpanel/21402

The OS is Windows 10. Screen is IPS 8bit

Problem is that very bad dithering! There is no PWM flicker of backlight (measured).

Tried the ditherig app v2, and v1.7 does not work at all. I can see pixels flashing like crazy with slow motion camera.

Why no 8bit option???

https://youtu.be/RnTJbIlIp7A

  • JTL replied to this.

    Thanks for sharing. We jump to dithering as a root cause of our issues on here but I am not sure it is; and I am also not sure if what you've shown is dithering or some kind of LCD inversion.

    A couple questions:

    1. Does the BIOS flicker like in your YouTube video? If so, it is not Windows 10.
    2. If the BIOS does not flicker, I'd suggest trying something like MXLinux.
    3. What is the GPU? ditherig only works on Intel and some AMD graphics. It will not work on NVIDIA.
    4. Have you tried an external monitor?

      smilem 24-bit color = 8-bits per channel (because R, G, B)

        ryans hanks for sharing. We jump to dithering as a root cause of our issues on here but I am not sure it is; and I am also not sure if what you've shown is dithering or some kind of LCD inversion.

        Well for some reason the video plays at too fast rate. On my phone LCD I see slow motion patterns appear and changing.

        1. "Does the BIOS flicker like in your YouTube video? If so, it is not Windows 10."

        NO

        I also tried Win 10LTSC x64 v21H2 MSDN to boot to repair windows menu. No Flicker there. This is just a way if anyone wants to test their setup.

        1. "If the BIOS does not flicker, I'd suggest trying something like MXLinux."

        I'm not a linux guy, even if it works I will not use linux of any kind.

        1. "What is the GPU?"

        GPU is Intel integrated HD4000 and Nvidia 630M

        1. "Have you tried an external monitor?"

        Yes, no flicker there connected to VGA port.

        JTL

        "24-bit color = 8-bits per channel (because R, G, B)"

        No change, any config flickers under win 10, others untested.

        • JTL replied to this.

          smilem Doesn't change what I said, just explaining what 18 and 24-bit notation actually mean.

            JTL

            "Doesn't change what I said, just explaining what 18 and 24-bit notation actually mean."

            Thanks for your input. I reinstalled the win 10 with default intel driver and default nvidia driver from windows update.

            There is no dither in windows in these old version of graphics drivers. But as soon as I use browser any of them FF, Chrome, Opera there is temporal dithering in everything. The FF as switch to turn it off, but it does not do anything. I can see on camera the flicker is still there.

            Obviously old browser from 2015-2017??? would work, but the pages would not load in such old browser.

            1. Why is there no plugin that disables temporal dithering?
            2. Why is there no hack to disable it win driver level? I did manage to pay 100USD to a hacked to hack printer driver paper length when I needed to print panorama photos on my printer. Having good driver (old version), bad driver (new version) should be easy start.
            3. Why no kickstarter to hack the driver? I've seen ridiculous project got ten of thousands of USD there. While it's enough to stash 10000USD for this to be done in days I suppose.

              smilem but the pages would not load in such old browser

              Try Waterfox or K-Meleon. I think most websites will load no issues. You can also try "mobile" versions of the website like m.facebook.com

              smilem Why is there no hack to disable it win driver level?

              I've had a "crazy" idea which is using a device like a Rasberry Pi with input/output HDMIs, and taking "bad" input and removing temporal dithering (or any known sources of flicker) and sending it back out via HDMI. For example you'd plug your "bad" computer into the Rasberry Pi HDMI and another HDMI into the Rasberry Pi for your monitor -- and your monitor would get the "clean" signal from your deskop.

              This would theoretically work without having to worry about every driver in existence and for people who can't install software on a corporate device.

              It would work by "holding" back a frame or several, and applying some diff between the frames, and if the diff is small enough, it will change the frame to not flicker. If we were able to present the device as having a high Hz (360Hz) it may not be a large difference from a regular 60Hz monitor.

              I have no idea if it would work in any way (will it fix eye strain, will it work technically).

              But it is an idea to hack on.

              Nice idea to clean signal, if you have Rasberry Pi you turn off it allready like it is written here?

              everyone seem to try enable dithering stupid idiots, seems it's off by default. Can anyone confirm this working as dithering filter?

              https://forums.raspberrypi.com/viewtopic.php?t=45290

              I will be trying it.. it does seem like it works..

              https://retropie.org.uk/forum/topic/28071/piboy-dmg-18bit-color-banding/2

              So it's a /boot/config.txt file, excellent.

              Here is everything you can stuff in it, the above flag is not included in the public-facing documentation but if it was still working in 2020, I see no reason why it wouldn't still be working. This is actually pretty awesome info. I will try it on a LCD for sure on my first generation unit (which isn't a complete waste of time because I planned to use it with a CRT).

              https://www.raspberrypi.com/documentation/computers/config_txt.html

              5 days later

              smilem There is no dither in windows in these old version of graphics drivers. But as soon as I use browser any of them FF, Chrome, Opera there is temporal dithering in everything. The FF as switch to turn it off, but it does not do anything. I can see on camera the flicker is still there.

              Don't think I can comment on what individual applications are doing, but I will say this.

              smilem Why is there no hack to disable it win driver level? I did manage to pay 100USD to a hacked to hack printer driver paper length when I needed to print panorama photos on my printer. Having good driver (old version), bad driver (new version) should be easy start.

              It's a bit apples and oranges but sometime in the past someone complained on the Intel forums that allegedly a model of laptop with one version of the driver did not cause eyestrain while a newer version did. And Intel (IMO) used a flawed methodology because they sent two identical laptops that supposedly only differed by the driver version to a testing lab which measured for PWM, blue light and other "obvious" factors and when there was no difference they closed the case on their end. It's easy to get upset at this but what I think the issue is trying to engage with development of any solution is without a clear "cause and effect" relationship there are many different things that cause the vague description of "eyestrain" and unless someone at these tech companies is REALLY bored or personally experiences the issue, don't expect to be investigated and solved by them.

              Of course this could speak volumes about the fact Intel seemingly has trouble investigating differences of GPU output between driver versions, however I recall the "good" driver may have been from 2011 and its age may have placed limitations on how much they could actually compare between it and a newer driver in terms of the code internally.

              2 months later

              ditherig author does not answer to emails, the program clearly does not work in my computer. I shows temporal flicker videos about it. I wrote ditherig author 2 times and no reply. I thought he will fix his software.

              Has anyone got a reply from him? His email is s_kawamoto2307 at yahoo.co.jp

              a year later

              OPPLE V3 give false reading on this display.

              Radex says it is flickering at 20Hz Primary frequency when set to 40Hz refresh with visible flickering:

              The OPPLE v3 says it is flickering at 38584Hz when set to 40Hz refresh with visible flickering:

              dev