[monitor] some monitors testing & experience
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Monitor: ViewSonic VX2758-2K-PRO (27 inch)
Panel: Fastips panel (8 bit)
Resolution: 2560 * 1440
Brightness: 100%
Refresh rate: 180hz
Graphics Card: Gigabyte AMD RX6400
OS: Ubuntu 23.10
Eyestrain: Eye strain exist.
Dont use AMD card, eye strain still exists.
I just built a PC as I'm experimenting with moving away from Apple and their flickering displays and wow AMD cards are awdul. I have now tried both the built-in UHD 730 and then a RX 5500 XT and the AMD card gave me almost instantaneous sore, dry eyes, a headache, nausea and neck pain within minutes as I tried to change settings and to turn off dithering by outputting native 8bit and limiting colour. This is on a PWM-free display with Windows 11. The Intel iGPU is currently tolerable but I'm still testing.
languidicity Try Windows 10 versions 21H2, 21H1, 20H2, 2004, and 1809.1098 and see if any of those versions remove the strain with the 5500 XT. Its also worth trying Linux with that 5500 XT.
Thanks. I’m still testing things but have now sent the 5500 XT back. I couldn’t disable dithering or get a signal output from it that felt useable so unfortunately this rules out AMD cards for me right now. I have a RTX 3060 on the way so will see what happens with that.
I have considered Windows 10 but in the first instance I am persevering with Win11 as I want to get to a place computing-wise where I can at least hope for a settled ecosystem in the mid-term. Tangentially my reason for wanting to move away from Apple is that even though right now there are workarounds and mitigations to their flickering screens - I have an iPhone 11 that I’m comfortable enough with and as per another thread dithering can now be disabled in macOS - they are moving to OLEDs across their entire product portfolio in the next few years and have scaled back their Mini-LED development as well (for now). So no point in sticking with Apple as I wouldn’t be able to use any of their upcoming devices outside of desktop Mac’s and even then I couldn’t hinge my hopes on the software workaround to disable dithering to work indefinitely. Which brings me back to Windows 10 as that will be EOL next year, which is too soon to build things around. I would like a solution now while I’m changing things wholesale as otherwise I’ll only have to go through all of this again next year if I go with Win10. Also I’m planning for this desktop build to be only something of a short term solution itself for my primary computing needs and want a laptop at some point. MacBooks are ruled out and new laptops are exclusively Win11. Not only that but with these AMD issues I’m wary of getting an AMD laptop so my options are narrowing. And I only have so much time, money and energy for this stuff. Windows 11 and Android at least give me options and the ability to choose specific screens and more granular control over display characteristics than Apple. But it’s undoubtedly a minefield.
It’s unfortunate that Linux isn’t an option as I like the idea of it but there is software I use which is exclusive to Windows/macOS.
Anyway I will post back once the RTX 3060 is installed.
eDenon-2 I'm farsighted. Spent my youth in front of CRTs and later LCDs. I stopped using glasses in college (20 years ago), got used to reading extensively without glasses but mainly physical books and under good natural lightning. Always use bias lights and have a Dell U series CCFL monitor back in Slovenia which I set to really low brightness. My problems with light refraction began a couple of years ago after I played around with new tech. Dell P2313H (IPS W-LED) is still pretty good on my eyes, I'm currently testing a dual U2415 setup now and the problem is the panels seem to have different coating and this could be a problem too.
However there seems to be a small correlation with going from Nvidia GTX670 to AMD RX cards, but can't confirm (correlation is not causation)… All in all I think cables, video cards, refresh rate can all impact people differently.
I suppose I should consider seeing an eye doctor to get my eyes checked, considering I'm moving into a middle-aged period of my life and being pretty busy with "office work" recently.
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jordan I can't confirm, because I haven't been using ARC GPU for 2 months now. I remember though that when I played with two of my setups in 2 different settings (rooms) with two monitors I had the following impressions:
Setup1 @ Room1 (AMD GPU)
Enclosed without direct sunlight, smaller desk, monitor closer to eyes
Intel CPU, AMD R9 380
Setup2 @ Room2
AMD CPU, Intel A770 (Intel GPU)
Southern side, curtains need to be closed for optimal work experience, monitor can be set quite far away.
Both setups use bias lightning.
Monitor1
Dell P2314 23'' IPS WLED
Monitor2
Samsung SJ55W 34'' VA WLED
I've been moving things around during my December gaming spree and found out I cannot use Monitor 2 in the Setup 1. I was simply getting strained really fast and later opted to pair it with Setup 2. I never thought about that the problem might be with the graphics card (dithering problems?).
I also used the Monitor 1 with Setup 2 for an extensive gaming period (1 month) and really close to my eyes. The problem was not as big knowing I spent about 3 weeks in half a day gaming.
I'm using the 1st setup with 1st monitor for office now and 2nd setup with 2nd monitor for gaming (no time now).
The setup I like and use the most for browsing is actually a JMGO O1 Pro LED projector (Monitor 3) in the living room PC with Intel iGPU (Setup 3 @ Room 3). It doesn't strain my eyes and I usually fall asleep early watching movies or even browsing the web.
The fourth testing ground is in my office at work, which is naturally lit on the northern side. I just bought a dual Dell U2415 (Monitor 4), but I am using an AMD RX550 card (Setup 4). Been experiencing lots of eyestrain, dryness days after and mild headaches, just by looking at the monitor, but this might be to various reasons:
- Eyes not yet adapted to the new monitor(s)
- Different coating on the monitors (one is 5 levels brighter and has a brighter color profile too -> spent an hour calibrating)
- used to have problems with flicker on the right side of a brighter monitor, but narrowed it down to a "faulty" DP to miniDP cable
- Positioning of the monitors
- GPU
Hope this helps with finding solutions to some of the questions regarding eyestrain / GPU use in Linux.
zimci do you know if the JMGO O1 Pro LED uses PWM ?
I have heard amd GPUs are more problematic. I think the w5500 pro AMD GPU however could be something that could be better in Linux. I think there's certain kernels/compositor or whatever it was for Linux I can't remember but certain versions seem to be better in terms of comfort.
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jordan Regarding JMGO O1 Pro, when I first started using it 2 years ago and put it in Room2. I still wanted to set the brightness a tad lower, cause room is not well lit, and couldn't do it by hardware so I used X11's software to do so. I remember having some eyestrain with it at the time. Later on I moved it to the living room and the laser light broke last summer. After repair and using it mainly at night without software dimming probably fixed the issue of slight eyestrain. Brightness cannot be set, meaning there is probably no PWM.
For Linux drivers I use amdgpu for AMD and mesa for Intel. Might be worth buying a low-end A380 and comparing results. This should be a cheaper solution than pricey AMD W5500 PRO.
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Okay guys,
did some testing on the monitor Samsung SJ55W (Monitor 2) that has been giving me problems for 3 years until I switched to Intel ARC (Setup2) in December. I must say there was a noticeable difference when I just switched back to AMD Setup1 minutes ago.
The monitor settings and cabling are the same, but when I use this LCD inversion test there is a noticable flicker in AMD Setup1 on 4a and 5 pattern, especially at 60Hz and less pronounced at 75Hz, whereas Intel ARC Setup2 produces a clear picture both on 60Hz and 75Hz.
Maybe AMD driver was truly the problem all along and the VA panel is actually not faulty as I always thought. All in all I am coming on to something and might try buying an Intel card for testing other setups, too!
I tried some other tests as well, Samsung panel seems to fare the best in these, especially paired with Intel ARC. To repeat, I am using Linux on both mentioned setups (PopOS for Setup1 and Nobara for Setup2), no Windows test.
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Monitor: HKC VG275QM (27 inch)
Panel: HVA (8 bit)
Resolution: 2560 * 1440
Brightness: 100%
Refresh rate: 170hz
Graphics Card: Intel Arc A380 (also tried AMD RX6400, eyestrain free too)
Cable: DisplayPort
OS: Ubuntu 24.04
Eyestrain: Eyestrain free
I bought a new display: HKC VG275QM, the HVA panel is similar to VA panel but with high refresh rate. This display is very soft and great for eyes. This is my fifth monitor, and now I feel that the VA screen is the most comfortable and eye friendly.
eDenon-2 Monitor: HKC VG275QM (27 inch)
Panel: HVA (8 bit)
Resolution: 2560 * 1440
Brightness: 100%
Refresh rate: 170hz
Graphics Card: intel Arc A380
OS: Ubuntu 23.10
Eyestrain: Eyestrain free
I see Arc A380 video cards can be had for cheap, when I look for HKC VG275QM on Amazon I see an Asus monitor with that product ID, is that the same monitor?
Interesting to see a Refresh rate that high
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ensete
The monitor is on taobao.
Here is a middle man taobao site for US buyers. (Product link translated)
https://parcelup.com/shop/item.php?id=713816539392#5291000911100