simplex Unusable as in causes too much strain to use, before testing specific 1809 builds i tested 2004/20H2/21H2 and several Linux distros, all of them with the A4000 displayed an unpleasant exaggerated/noisier image. When using the Turing based Quadro RTX 4000 which is basically just a RTX 2070 i can use this without problems on Linux and 1809 with no strain just like my old Quadro K4200.
JJack
- 2 hours ago
- Joined Feb 22, 2021
I have an RTX A4000 (based on RTX 3070) and measured its output with a lossless capture card in Bios (no dithering by default) and with dithering disabled in Color Control (no dithering picked up either in Windows) but its still doing some type of dithering that cant be picked up by a capture card as the colors look very over exaggerated/noisier than all my other GPU's. I also tested this very thoroughly on builds 1809: 17763.1098, 17763.107, and 17763.55 and it was still unusable. So far i havent seen a single success story with any Ampere cards based on the GA104 https://www.techpowerup.com/gpu-specs/nvidia-ga104.g964
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It could be the panel lottery in the laptops i have four of the same model laptops (same OS, driver version, everything the same) which are my go to, but one of them was causing strain despite it being exactly the same but i notice the screen looked different, the panel did not look the same as the others but i checked the hardware ID of the panel and it was a SHP1453 which means its a LQ156M1JW31 panel which is exactly the same panel in the other three units so i bought a replacement panel and swapped out the panel on the laptop causing strain and after it was perfectly comfortable like the other three laptops. It was literally down to panel lottery/quality control of the same model panel. If your own x280 always caused eyestrain it might be worth doing a screen swap on it.
Maxx So I would just like to stop all the nonsense with vitamins, minerals, suplements, emfs etc. This is really a big issue that is produced by the PWM flicer or some other form of flicker that does not seem to be temporal dithering in all cases or then ditherig somehow just removes dithering and leaves some other form of flicker.
After testing many GPU's and spending some time with a new Iris Xe laptop i agree that there is some other type of dithering / compression going on that isnt able to be picked up by a lossless capture card. I think perhaps newer GPU's are using more aggressive memory compression algorithms which could possibly have some type of dithering which is part of the compression process and a capture card isnt able to detect it.
languidicity Try Windows 10 versions 21H2, 21H1, 20H2, 2004, and 1809.1098 and see if any of those versions remove the strain with the 5500 XT. Its also worth trying Linux with that 5500 XT.
TUV passed the abomination which is the Dell U3219Q, i dont trust any of their certifications anymore.
AlanSmith Wow thats crazy so both Dell and Eizo are lying about their "10-bit" panels being true 10-bit? I heard rumors that the UP2720Q uses the same panel as the CS2740 and the coincidence that both these "10-bit" panel use forced dithering in even in 8bit mode seems to confirm that. Eizo themselves claim its true 10bit though or do you think they really are lying?
Still testing some other motherboard platforms, but i was unable to get my RTX A4000 to work without strain on my Z490. I even tested it with a lossless capture card and the card itself doesnt dither in the BIOS. If i swap over to a Quadro RTX 4000 or K4200 the strain is gone.
Thats the first review ive seen mention the UP2720Q is 8bit+2bit FRC, several other reviews and Dell themselves claims its true 10bit. In my case though the monitor is not the problem since i have several configurations which i can use this monitor strain free. The EW2780U is 8bit+2bit FRC but that review is saying the +2bit FRC only comes into play when displaying HDR. Are they trying to say the UP2720Q is using FRC even at 8bit?
bpo19 This is the link to the post https://discussions.apple.com/thread/254774275
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One of my good monitors is a Dell U2720Q produced in August 2021 and I recently got another produced in May 2023 and this thing burns my eyes even on very reliable safe GPU like the Quadro K4200, pretty sure its a completely different panel since the way the image is presented is completely different looking.
brjdenis Thats great news congrats on getting some cards that work for you, i also find the Kepler and Fermi Quadro cards are the most reliable choice, i built a streaming box with an extra K4200 i had and the output to my TV is just super. Just wondering what motherboard are you using? If your using a prebuilt computer which model is it?
Just tried this since i havent tested my 5700 XT in a long time, i think the last time was on my X79 motherboard, tested on my Evga Z490 Dark-KP and it produced the same exact strain that i remember it produced on my X79 motherboard.
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BloodyHell619 What model motherboard do you have? Try flashing the original release bios version to it and if the release bios doesnt fix it flash a version of the bios that has a release date as close as possible to the release date of the graphics card or the date of the vbios. If your motherboard model doesnt have a lot of bios version to select from then save a copy of your GPU's original vbios and use the GOP update tool to change the GOP version inside the vbios file and flash it to see if fixed the issue. Use "nvflash64.exe --version romnamehere.rom" to check which GOP version your vbios has and select one that is the same size as the original to add into the vbios file.
@JTL I do want to pickup a lossless capture card but the only model that seems to be lossless is the DVI2PCIe, i wanted to check if there are other lossless PCI-e capture cards available but if not i will pickup DVI2PCIe to get some actual captures of a bad setup and good setup.
Sunspark I have an identical second system im working on that uses the same model motherboard so ill work on making the RTX A4000 Ampere based card comfortable, so ill be able to test all these possible combinations soon. My Quadro RTX 4000 has a waterblock on it currently so its not so quick to swap it out to test in my primary system.
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So something interesting happened, i decided to update my BIOS on my EVGA Z490 Dark motherboard to test if a newer BIOS would allow me any more overclocking headroom and once i upgraded from version 1.07 released on 9/28/2020 to version 1.10 released on 11/11/2021 i started to experience eyestrain with my Quadro RTX 4000, even the BIOS screen had the strange smeared/glossy/blurry look that other bad cards ive tested had. I flashed the BIOS back to version 1.07 and everything went back to normal and is comfortable. I recommended anyone battling with a bad card to flash and test the entire range of BIOSes available for the motherboard.
Maybe this could be caused by the GOP of the motherboard BIOS interacting with the GOP modules on the GPU in different ways and some work better with certain models of GPU's than others.
https://winraid.level1techs.com/t/gop-update-and-extraction-tool-nvidia-only/91381/
https://winraid.level1techs.com/t/amd-and-nvidia-gop-update-no-requests-diy/30917/923?page=36
https://ledstrain.org/d/261-what-works-for-you-what-do-you-use-now-without-problems/187
My current Quadro RTX 4000 BIOS has UEFI version 5000B, i also found an older bios version of my card that has UEFI version 5000A, and a new version that has version 5000D. I bet if i wanted to use the newer z490 dark bios i could update my UEFI GOP and it would be normal.
And here is a screenshot of a Quadro K4200 Kepler based GPU which is using UEFI version 1002F.
In a case where it was not possible to make a bad GPU comfortable by testing various different motherboard bios versions it would certainly be worth a try changing GOP versions in the GPU's vbios until a comfortable one is found.
I was running Windows 10 2004 for a while which was comfortable without problems on a Quadro RTX 4000 and even with the disable updates script it auto updated to Version 22H2 and i noticed eyestrain again. I got fed up with standard version of Windows and installed Windows Server 2022 which is based on 21H2 and so far this is the absolute best modern version of Windows 10 ive tried. Unfortunately Microsoft made it so consumer NIC's built into the motherboard need a slight driver inf mod to work but that only takes a few minutes https://blog.workinghardinit.work/2017/06/19/installing-intel-i211-i217v-i218v-i219v-drivers-windows-server-2016-eufi-boot/ and if your not running a Nvidia Quadro/A Series or Radeon Pro card the consumer card drivers need some tweaking to get installed on Server 2022.
I've had good luck with Sony phones the colors on these phones are very natural, I used an Xperia XZ1 which has no PWM after 25% brightness and at 24% brightness and below the PWM is 2358Hz which i found tolerable. I upgraded to an Xperia 1 IV in September 2022 which has an OLED screen and 500hz PWM but doesnt bother me. I cant use Xiaomi phones their color profiles really are just bad on my eyes and i never liked the way the colors looked on those phones either.
Just to make sure, check that the software dithering is 100% disabled through the registry since it has a habit enabling itself again, i noticed that with the Nvidia disable dither registry key that if your monitor goes to sleep or if you turn the monitor off and on again it will revert to temporal dithering. First disable dithering from the post here https://forums.guru3d.com/threads/nvidia-and-dithering-controls-how-to-enable.436621/ and then download ColorControl from here https://github.com/Maassoft/ColorControl. ColorControl will display your current dithering status and it will keep the settings locked in.
AGI Try using this bat script to disable the updates, this is what i use and ive never had a problem with updates coming back. https://wtools.io/paste-code/bKom
ryans Yes you can use this trick on either the integrated GPU or a second graphics card. This is what i also do on one of my other systems and it works amazing. https://forum.level1techs.com/t/gaming-on-my-tesla-more-likely-than-you-think/171185/70