Peter I think the key you said is "newer" laptop. Are there any known-good laptops you can use? If there is, I doubt the problem is you not being relaxed enough, as you would be assuming the same bodily posture on a different laptop and not having the same reaction.

Also, what if you hook up a newer laptop that gives you problems on an external computer monitor that normally you have no trouble with. Does the problem still occur?

    MagnuM

    Currently i use Inspiron 15 3000 win 10. Its a company pc. I have it for a year and everything seemed fine with some adjustments to the dell color settings and crizal glasses. Some time in the last 2 months some updates were installed and the laptop, although not unusable, it started causing me eye strain & headaches after an hour or so of use. IT in my company told me they do not understand why since display / graphics drivers were not updated.

    Currently the only the way to work with the dell without any issue is to connect it to my trusted LG Flatron W1946.

    Sorry for a bit offtopic, but i'm trying to finish my 'Lifestyle/Led' survey, but now there are only 16 answers.
    I would be very appreciate if you will take participation in it (it's short, will take only 5 minutes), otherwise it would be impossible to publish any statistically correct results. Thanks.

    Survey: https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSdh1-dNpMHlKDFwb_eVttWZ_rrVrh_hOMLd15GtGtVVb-hrJQ/viewform?usp=sf_link

    Survey thread: https://ledstrain.org/d/404-short-led-strain-daily-life-survey

      kammerer I can't remember if I have done the survey or not. I don't want to cause a double-entry if I did!

        MagnuM
        Sorry, but unfortunately I can't check it: survey doesn't gather emails and I didn't set option for only respond that's required checkin . But you can send me privately your answers for first two-three questions and i will try to identify you

        5 days later

        In a post above I mentioned my story in the neighbor thread. The main point of it is that our problems could be linked with restricted blood flow to brain and eyes. It could be caused by overstressed/overloaded neck muscles.

        Recently I've found an article that says that sitting in a wrong position (and work in front of computer usually implies such position) could cause neck muscles restructurisation. Such daily position triggers permanent tension in neck muscles and with time this new muscle scheme becomes default even for daily life. But with this new muscle scheme man get a restricted blood flow to head and muscle.

        Article in Russian with some neck exercises (with restrictions) could be found here: https://lifehacker.ru/napryazhenie-v-shee/

        Here is the article abstract part translation by deepl dot com:

        "Working at the computer is almost always the wrong back position and an extended head. Lifehacker shows exercises that will help stretch and relax hard neck muscles, preventing pain and other cervical spinal problems.

        When you're working on a computer, let alone a laptop, your neck is usually pushed forward.

        This causes excessive neck muscle strain, which has to keep the head in a non-physiological position.

        When the head comes forward and shoulders are raised, the upper part of the trapezoidal muscle and the occipital muscles are tensed. On the contrary, the clavicular-ociliary muscles stretch and lose their tone.

        [neck muscles image]

        Over time, muscles get used to being tense all the time, so you can't just relax them.

        What's more, collagen fascium fibers build up around your muscles and fix them in the wrong position, so you find it convenient.

        Tense neck muscles can cause hyperlordosis of the cervical spine - a condition where the neck is overly stretched forward.

        This, in turn, worsens the blood supply, can cause intervertebral hernia, cause nerve pinching and other problems.

        To avoid getting sick, warm up your neck muscles regularly while doing the exercises suggested. Some of these can easily be done even at the workplace or in the car, others will need a ball, mat or rubber band. They can be done at home or in the gym.

        Contraindications are severe neck pain or cervical spine problems such as hernia, nerve pinching or other conditions. In this case, you need qualified medical help and a physical therapist's recommendation."

        KM Hm, I too have jaw problems.

        Please count me too in. I considered wearing a mouth guard in the past, but I was a bit concerned about eventual side effects so I never did it in the end. Also, I never associated it with eyestrain, although I noticed correlations with my sinusitis and headaches.

        5 days later

        Today I was prescribed by an eye doctor drops containing vitamins to get rid of the twitching around my left eye. Luckily the spams showed up right while I was talking to him (Murphy law was violated). If I got it correctly, because our conversation was based on some kinda local google translator, if the problem persists I could get botox injections. Does it make sense? Is not that what chicks use to make themselves more beautiful? Anyhow, he said it is all caused by computer eyestrain. And I was like you got it! However, he did not comment on the fact that the twitching starts after seconds on my laptop and not hours. He also confirmed the weird neck pain is due to the eyestrain, and advised me to use electronic devices less. Less than seconds???
        I asked if it could make sense to get vision therapy and where. That is actually the main reasons why I went. He (his google translator) said we do not use "folk remedies" here.
        Not sure which way to go, except desperately looking at an hardware solution which temporarily drags me to peace, until the new laptop or update screw everything again. Maybe I should start getting high on botox. Maybe it is better than JTL's oil :-)

        • KM replied to this.

          AGI Less than seconds???

          The doctor I recently visited said it was unusual for symptoms to kick in within seconds after turning on problematic lights or displays. Nevertheless they were confident that prismatic lenses would help. The symptoms I described - eye strain, burning eyes, headaches - are typical for a convergence issue they said. Just not within seconds. I also mentioned my left eye usually hurts first and the location of the pain I described fitted their theory. I will report back in some days if the prismatic lense helps. It did not help the very next day. Usual symptoms within seconds. (Plus staying for many hours after stopping the exposure)

          • AGI replied to this.
          • AGI likes this.

            KM I will report back in some days if the prismatic lense helps.

            Did you wear any type of spectacles before?
            Were you also given eye exercises?
            When you say doctor, do you mean an eye doctor or an optometrist? I was explained the latter is not a medical doctor except in the US?

            • KM replied to this.

              AGI Yes, I currently wear +0.5 diopters prescribed recently by normal eye doctors. They want to increase it to +2.0 in slow steps every few months. Any other doctor before said I don't need glasses. I admit I see sharp despite the farsight. Last week I was at my local university eye clinic and was diagnosed with a conversion issue. The head of department himself was attending. A week later I visited their orthoptic department and got 4 pdpt (prism diopters) applied later in form of a patch/foil on the right glass. Their head of department talked to me, too. I'm still waiting for the detailed written report.

              • AGI replied to this.
              • AGI likes this.

                KM Yes, I currently wear +0.5 diopters prescribed recently by normal eye doctors. They want to increase it to +2.0 in slow steps every few months.

                Was this a plan to fight your symptoms at electronic devices?

                • KM replied to this.

                  AGI Yes, like 2 months ago I once again wanted to know if there's something wrong on the eye level despite previous doctors always saying "you don't need glasses" and after having visited 3 neurologists and an alternative practitioner, all who had no idea either and had never heard of the problem. This time with very strong eye drops the eye doctors measured 2.0 dpt, but some days later with +2.0 test glasses I couldn't see sharp at all at a distance of 2 m and more. So their plan is to slowly let the eyes adapt to increasing diopters.
                  Until the sight is 100% corrected I can't be sure the cause of the eye strain is not the eyes. Which I always thought up until 2 months ago.

                  • AGI replied to this.

                    KM Thanks. Are not the drops normally put after that eye test with the table at a few meters? Or do you mean the test was repeated after the drops and then you needed 2.0 dpt to see sharp?
                    So now you have 2.0 dpt and prismatic lenses, or do the latter imply getting rid of the former?

                    • KM replied to this.

                      AGI Under the effect of the eye drops they measured 2.0 dpt. I'm not sure if that measurement was done right since the doctor spoke broken German. I think the farsight and the convergence issue are separate issues. Currently I wear +0.5 dpt on both eyes and 4 pdpt on the right eye.

                      • AGI likes this.

                      Since this was the first time I was given vitamin drops for my eyes, I was checking on what they could potentially do. I bumped into this article

                      https://www.vitamindcouncil.org/new-study-suggests-vitamin-d-deficiency-is-related-to-dry-eye-08-2015/#.XE55Fy-B3BI

                      From memory the only thing that I was told was eventually off in my blood exams a few times was vitamin D.

                      Does any of you have the two, low levels of vitamin D and dry eyes?

                      • KM replied to this.

                        AGI The last time I checked I had a little less D than average. But nothing major. I then took some supplements.
                        I always wake up with dry eyes when having looked at displays or certain room lighting the day before. The dryness doesn't last longer than some minutes.

                        dev