Usable Smartphones?

reaganry

vaz real life review of Hisense A5 showing sideloaded apps, camera, etc.. just need to confirm it will work in the US. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RkfAeDzuEQA and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jPVfGJw9uMg

Maxx

reaganry That is an interesting idea, but takes away most of the reasons why smartphones are used, like camera for social media and looking at pictures. I would think that most people are able to use a phone just for the occasional call, e.g. if they avoid looking at the screen. But of course this suits for book reading.

I still kinda think that there would be the chance to get manufacturers to manufacture flicker free displays without any dithering/rendering functionality that causes problems for some.

Make a petition to Sony to restart manufacturing phones with flicker free LCD for those who are flicker sensitive?

Maxx

degen Not just PWM free, also flicker free. Huawei Nova 5t seems to have the dithering which is getting my eyes mildly bloodshot. Nova 5t seems to be a phone that I could tolerate, especially if I would try to limit my usage a bit. But why have phone that irritates the eyes, if I could have a phone that does not irritate at all, like XZ Premium. That should arrive from repair shop this week, if they are able to fix it.

Byt the way, my HPZR2740w display seems to be 10 display, so maybe that is the reason that it is OK to use with recent windows, as there is no need for the 8bit to 10bit dithering?

Apple products I will not touch.

Peter

Maxx Is this the phone you are talking about? I want to give it a try.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Sony-Premium-5-5-Inch-SIM-Free-Smartphone-Black/dp/B06X9R8FL8

Maxx

Yes. But please note that you have to install the LUX software and configure it so that it prevents the brightness going under 35% or then just not use automatic brightness.

For me it has been absolutely eye strain free for the past 2.5 years and yes, I would urge others who get eye strain from e.g. OLED displays, to try it out. (Not those who know that their problem is not PWM or dithering or any other flicker related)

Maxx

Confirming that Sony Xperia XZ2 Premium uses PWM at brightnesses well over 50%, so it is not usable. Luckily I can return it. Back to my trusty XZ Premium

Giunti

@Sunspark
I bought the A70 3 days ago. Much better than the 10 devices I used before. Headache that is not too bad and tolerable with 50 percent brightness. I believe a little more time is needed. Of course, with a blue light filter. Thank you

Sunspark

Giunti I don't use this particular feature, but go into digital wellbeing, wind down and flip on greyscale and see how you like it. You might find it of value at times. Also for me, screen zoom at midpoint, font size two notches to the right from the left side of the screen.

Peter

Giunti My wife had it and while in the beginning it was straining me now it seems ok. I wanted a dual SIM phone and i switched my Pixel 3aXL temporarily with my wife to test the A70. Seems like i got used to it. A70 along with Pixel 3aXL are the only ones that i can somehow tolerate. Actually at the moment i feel the A70 to be more friendly in the eyes than the pixel.

degen

Giunti How is the A70 treating you now that you've had more time with the phone? Also, if you have time could you share your experiences with some of those other devices?

Maxx

a70 is an a oled with 240hz PWM, so not suitable for those who are sensitive to flicker. Sama as any Samsung phone.

degen

Maxx Galaxy M20 has an LCD screen and does not utilize PWM.

degen

I am testing the Galaxy S10. My first impression is that OLED Saver does not increase screen comfort, and the output looks less clean. Perhaps the software overlay is introducing additional dithering or other shenanigans, such as I observed with f.lux on Windows on my Paperlike Pro experiments.

The output is certainly cleaner than the Huawei P30, but I dislike knowingly subjecting myself to PWM.

Sunspark

degen I honestly think you will get more used to it. I feel oled PWM isn't quite the same as LCD PWM. I actually have the brightness on my screen turned down a lot often. I usually try to keep it just above the point I don't blatantly see my fingers strobing. Don't use vivid mode. Use srgb ("Natural"). Anyway I don't feel my device is perfect. It isn't. It's good enough for now.

jasonpicard

degen https://in.mashable.com/tech/10935/oppo-f15-review-high-on-style-low-on-performance See this phone that's coming out? It's using a feature called DC Dimming 2.0. I wonder what's different about it this version.

degen

For some reason the S10 still flickers at 255/255 brightness on slow-mo video taken on a Pixel 3. Any ideas?

JTL

jasonpicard I heard the same and am curious too

degen

S10 was very painful by the end of the second day. Wow! I haven't experienced eye strain from a device like that in years.

Sunspark

degen Unfortunate. You should return it. Maybe consider the Hisense A5 when some more folks receive theirs.

degen

My latest experiment is the Huawei P20 (non-pro). It has an LCD screen unlike the P30. It does not utilize PWM, but dithering patterns are fairly obvious. I will report back in a week or so.

degen

degen P20 is another failure. Tightness around my eyes when doing some basic texting. Not good enough.

ryans

The Samsung Galaxy S20 will supposedly offer an "OLED HD 120Hz" screen. Although OLED has PWM, it could be a different enough screen that it's worth trying.

JTL

ryans Sure thing. While I think the phone industry is being condescending and silly removing features, that aside it could be interesting.

According to NotebookCheck regarding the Pixel 4

The 5.7-inch OLED display runs at a native resolution of 2280x1080 (which makes for a high pixel density) and is one of the smaller panels available today. The display supports a refresh rate of up to 90 Hz. We cannot confirm claims that this support is not available at lower levels of brightness as we were able to detect the increased PWM frequency range typical for 90 Hz panels regardless of display brightness. That said, PWM frequencies fluctuated significantly between 176.1 and 367.6 Hz and are thus low enough to potentially cause eye strain and headaches in sensitive users.

So just having a higher display refresh rate doesn't seem to mean much. In theory the OLED PWM frequency seems to correlate with the screen "refresh rate" (r * 4), but the implementations can differ.

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