machala so after many years I finally started looking into NVidia timing settings and tried some of the other timing algorithms

Thanks for sharing! Is this some NVIDIA settings? I don't use NVIDIA but a screenshot could be useful 🙂

machala Burned in images disappeared and flickering was getting better.

Just wondering, is this an IPS or TN or OLED panel?

    ryans

    It is an IPS laptop panel.

    I can't show you a screenshot as I don't want to initiate creation of this custom resolution again (for obvious reasons) - unfortunately this part of the NVidia control panel behaves a little bit strange.

    It is in NVCP, Change resolution, under the resolution list click on customize and then create your own resolution. This allows you to build a custom profile for resolution, refresh rate as well as related timing.

    However I can't say changing timing here solves the issue on setups where you have the problem, I tried on other systems and it does not fix it for me, but trying different algorithms does change the "feeling". Perhaps if we knew exact meaning of the numbers we could set it up manually… or some part of the timing is just built-in and you can't change it. But the point of the whole post is that I now see this timing as the main source of all the issues I am experiencing. You need to see it to be able to say that I guess.

    Coincidence or not, I'm testing in the last days a similar theory. In my quest to find something bearable for my eyes, I have bought a new laptop (TN), and the screen seems bearable so far (5 days of testing). But the refresh rate is terribly low (60Hz, also because the screen response time is quite bad) so I was trying to raise the refresh rate with the CRU software.

    Turns out, I have modified a 1080p profile in the software that have the wrong polarity (positive for Vertical instead of negative), the screen worked fine but in the next minutes and hours I started to have the same feeling that I have with any other screen I have (all IPS, except for the new laptop). After looking into the settings I realize the difference between the stock settings and the custom profile, so I tried to fix it. I felt relieved a few moments later but was not enough.

    Then I replicated all the stock settings except for the refresh rate into a new custom resolution. I have been using it in the last 2 days, I would test for more time before posting here, but after seeing this topic I could not resist.

    Also, I applied the laptop settings to my monitor (Gigabyte G24F) about 12h ago, it's working fine and seems easy on my eyes than before, but still not good as the TN laptop. I'll continue testing for a few days more, but if this is not all placebo effect, I would risk saying that those reference numbers are really helping but not perfect, maybe because they are just from a random laptop that is not perfect on my eyes either.

    If you are willing to try, please back up your files and settings

    *Please turn off Freesync/Gsync before doing this, otherwise it may fail. You can turn it back on after you're done.*

    This can be easily done through the AMD driver (if you have an AMD graphic card/APU): Open the "AMD Radeon Software" > Click on the gear icon at the top right > Click on Display > Scroll down until "Display specs" and expand it > Save you original parameters in case something goes too wrong > On the right side, click on "Create New" next to "Custom resolutions" > Enter the new parameters and save it.

    Through CRU (Custom Resolution Utility - Please check the developer's website for more details and double-check everything, something may go wrong, be aware of the issues you may cause): Open the app > Choose the monitor you want to try (active) > just below on "Detailed resolutions" click on the "add" button > Choose "Manual" on Timming > Fill up with the desired parameters > Click Ok (2x) > Restart the video driver or the PC

    My "good" parameters:

    https://imgur.com/BwmFVAa

      JTL changed the title to Potential correlation between video timings and flicker .

      ryans

      Yes, kind of, I think. So far so good, the experiment still holds up, it looks easier on the eyes and no issues with my external monitor that I applied the settings to.

        Hazard what would be the equivalent settings for a resolution of 2560*1440?

          karut

          Unfortunately, I can't answer that, as my "good sample" is 1080p native. But maybe if this theory holds up through other users testing it, then someone with a different resolution (from a good setup) may share their good parameters too. Even for 1080p, it might have something better out there.

            Hazard

            I have an Asus G752VT laptop (i7-6700HQ, GTX 970M Nvidia GFX) from 2016 with a 17.3inch 75hz IPS screen that I am totally comfortable with.
            Then, I bought this Asus EyeCare Monitor VA24DQ which is a 24" FHD 75hz monitor.
            So the monitor has the same resolution and refresh rate as my laptop, but here I get dizzy and headachey in 1-2hrs of usage.

            So how would I go about replicating my perfectly fine laptop display config onto my external Asus monitor?
            I just need to install the CRU utility and go from there?
            Is it straight forward?

              Deepak

              Yes, you would have to copy the same parameters I show in my screenshot from your good setup and then create & apply a new custom resolution with those same settings on your external monitor.

              If the Nvidia software doesn't have an option for this, I suggest you the CRU software.

              *Please turn off Freesync/Gsync before doing this, otherwise it may fail. You can turn it back on after you're done.*

                machala any serious health condition

                but most people are not suffered from this…and only we are(a very small minority). How could your theory explain this?

                  arturpanteleev Doesnt that apply to all theories on this board? Probably some variation in brain function that only affects a small population (lower threshold in processing flicker as movement, inability to compensate for it), maybe in combination with some binocular vision dysfunction. Perhaps think of it like the also relatively small group of those idiopathic epilepsy whose nerves are more easily "overexcited" and an even smaller subgroups of those affected are sensitive to flicker as a trigger for a seizure.

                  Hazard
                  Thanks for the instructions.
                  I tried copying the info from my good laptop screen to the external Asus monitor.
                  I still get quite dizzy tho unfortunately (even with the polarity changed to +/-, and the other settings).

                    Deepak

                    Thanks for testing, this can be somewhat of a placebo in fact, or help/make it worse a little.

                    Timing formulas are kind of strange in a way because they're legacy artifacts of back when electron gun CRTs were around, that's where the polarity stuff comes from. LCDs don't have a polarity. There's a bunch of formulas but they all have the same object, to draw the raster image from top to bottom.

                    The main difference between GTF and CVT-RB is that the RB has tighter timings for reduced blanking interval, meaning it needs less pixel bandwidth and doesn't have as long a delay before drawing the next frame.

                    RB is needed at higher resolutions on links that don't have tons of bandwidth such as DVI or HDMI 1.4.

                    There is a difference and it is visible depending on the setup, but it's not a night and day difference.

                    a month later

                    So unfortunately after thorough testing I have to say this is probably a dead end and my conclusions were a little bit premature. I do see differences though with different timings, but I was unable to really fix my new PC that produces an unbearable picture for me using this method. However, thanks to what happened to me I have another finding about monitors that I will speak of in a new thread.

                    • JTL replied to this.

                      arturpanteleev To be honest I don't think that only a very small minority is affected. In fact I strongly believe that the problem is more major, but many people just don't realize it as a problem. For example I can explain the huge popularity of OS dark themes with nothing than the fact that dark theme reduces flickering (true for PWM on AMOLED for example). Lots of people have never used older Windows (Even older builds of Windows 10) and they have never experienced non-flickering displays and OS. So they accept as a fact that their eyes get tired quickly from computer and practice that bullshit techniques like 20-20-20, enable nigh shift, wear yellow glasses etc. I have been staring at computer screens for hours since the beginning of 2000-s and have never ever experienced any kind of eye strain until I have updated to latest Windows 10 and to MacOS Monterey on my Macbook last year.

                      dev