Safe hardware PC builds list

simplex

Updated first post with Arc B580 GPU research @WhisperingWind this could be interesting for you 🙂

jordan

simplex What is Pixel Extension=Zero Extended ?

simplex

Updated first post with UHD730 ( Intel i5 13400 iGPU ) research

simplex

Recently I received rtx4060 for test and got eye-strain: pain in the edge of the eyebrows, closer to nose, where the nerve endings come out. Then I felt how my eyeballs are inflating (increasing pressure), then brainfog. Research on the NVIDIA forum showed that one of the stages of the display graphics pipeline,uses a shift in pixel values +-1 even on a static background. I assumed that using 8-bit temporal dithering would make the entire screen buzzing but at the same time masking these +-1 flickering. And yes, the symptoms became weaker. After a couple of hours playing on RTX4060, I decided to read from my phone and found that I could not focus. I do not have a capture card, but I assume that with temporal dithering, all the font edges were constantly moving.

Perhaps when you can not focus on the screen of a phone or monitor or other device, it uses temporal dithering

simplex

I suppose, it all about LED technology ( 3 color spectrums ), and flickering level of software + GPU + monitor. I noticed, my optical brain center, very used to the old type of flickering, it adapted (as with any normal person) and I don’t notice any flickering.

But if I change one of 3 components ( software + GPU + monitor ), first reaction is sensor overload. In my case, issue is not related for eyes, it fully for braincenter. I can replace one of component, if it gives me same flickering pattern. I think, our brain react for each pixel flicker, but hopefully we dont notice it.

I analyzed how I got stuck for old equipment. I replaced CCFL monitor to LED in ~2018, my grapfic cards were 1050ti, than 1060. In 2022 I started to use 2070s. Same time, my wife started to use 3080 and 3080ti. Drivers were installed once, OS updates were blocked. Then, in feb 2024, I replaced 2070s to 3080 and started to feel strain. Then I changes some grapfic driver settings in my wife setup and she also got strain.

I replaced my 2070s to 1060, and her 3080ti to 2080s. Nowadays I feel okay, and she feel as more tension as more hours she spent near PC.

After 1 week without any PCs, I sit for 2070s and all was okay. But after 2..7 days I started to feel strain, my sleep gone bad, in mornin I felt like I work all the night. And finally switched for old 1060, which also bother me ~1 week.

Same for wife's 2080s. After 1 week without PC, she started to use it with new monitor, but no more than 1h per day and not every day. And 1st pain she got after 2 weeks! Now she use PC every day and feel strain.

I think, new GPU and new monitors, use something like pixel blending, which has chaos structure ( random overlay noise ). And optical braincenter cant adapt for it, because there is no repeating patterns, it has random vectors. Brain starts to analyze it all and got overload.

The joke is, if you use "random noise device" once for a long time, your brain starts to mark all similar devices as bad. And you get sensitivity for free-of-flickering monitors, GPUs, phones. Thats why GPUs like 1060/1660 and hp omen 27q with LG panel marked as safe in this forum - they dont use random blending noise.

Any thoughts?

K-Moss

simplex Your wife uses the computer every day now and gets significant strain every single day as well? Yet at first she had no symptoms? In other words, the effects on her are cumulative?

AlanSmith

simplex Any thoughts?

Safe AMD up to RX 5000/6000 Bad are RX 7000/9000 series

Safe Intel up to HD 630 Bad Graphics Xe (11 series) and newer

Safe Nvidia up to GTX 1660 Bad from RTX 2000 to 5000 series

APU Vega и and older (it’s ok) on APU RDNA is easy to turn off

ensete

There is no such thing as a "Safe" hardware list. Or phone list. Or Operating system list. Or any list.

My biggest gripe about this community is so many peopel insitance that we are have the exact same triggers and symptoms. We don't. It's not always PWN. It;s not always dithering, temporal or otherwise. It's not always flicker, or OLEd, or whatever.

Really irks me when people try to stick others into their box. Everyone is unique.

simplex

ensete Everyone is unique

Yep. How do you think, you get sensitivity after using "specific" device, or after "time" with normal device? Whats your point of no return

simplex

K-Moss

Yep

Same false signal I got few month ago, when switch 1060 to 2070s to play tempest rising. First few days I felt nothing, but then got "brain strain". The difference is, before 2070s, I use 1060 every day, without 1 week gap. And got strain "faster"

K-Moss

simplex So you think having one bad device, like an OLED screen with obnoxious PWM, can give one a kind of allergy to ALL devices/screens?

simplex

K-Moss

Sure. The more factors (LED technology flickering devices) that irritate brain (in my case) around, the stronger brain will experience problems and see danger in “safe” devices which also has LED spectrums

simplex

I found some facts that prove that the problem is in the brain's neural adaptation to flickering, here is link ( 2 and 3 page ). This man change a lot of phones without success, and here is results of his electroencephalography. Also, @jen research could be userful -> https://www.flickersense.org/testing-leds-and-screens

To sum up: people get new flickering device and can't use it, only switching back to old one, helps

I think, using any visual device = adapting to its flickering. Apparently, the "previous" device was very stressful for the brain, because it had adapted so deeply to it, and adaptations to new devices cause new stress for existy stressy brain

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