Eyestrain solved after 6 years and multiple panels - LG 32gk850g

f3likx I have a Pixel 2 which causes eyestrain, but with the "night mode" enabled, it seems to have almost zero eyestrain.

This caught my attention. Does anyone know why this would be? Those utilities aren't reducing bluelight frequencies getting to your eyes really, just tinting things, so even if you were hypersensitive to blue light it shouldn't make such a difference. I wonder if "night mode" changes some other aspect like dithering or something else?

Interesting the Shield is fine...what Android version is it running?

It IS very frustrating how so many displays are so bright, some even at the lowest possible setting, and how people seem to laud massive bright displays on review sites. They act like anything under 300nits is simply unsuable but I never go above the lowest two steps on any backlight.

deepflame enabling 10 bit on the amd turns off dithering? do you need a true 10 bit monitor?

deepflame Enabling 10-bit color support tells the driver that I use a 10-bit display and turns off dithering. Interestingly this also works without a 10-bit screen.

So if tricking the app into thinking you have a 10-bit display keeps it from dithering within the app, I wonder if we could do this system wide? @JTL is this something you could use or alraedy are? Is there a way to trick the entire system/gpu/whatever does that request for system wide dithering into believing we have a 10-bit or greater display and this avoiding it needing to turn on dithering for our actual 6 or 8 bit panels? Using a "quality" greater than its request would be better if it would work because you could tell it something wild like "this is a 128bit display" etc it would cover us long term rather than chasing 10-bits then the next thing on and on.

KM I have an idea about this: Pixel 2 is AMOLED.

I think I follow what you have written but am missing how that explains that the night mode tinting causes strain on the Amoled.

JTL there are people on forums complaining about 10xx series nvidia cards not having dithering enabled and them having problems with banding due to it. So a lot of mixed info out there not sure how to test.

If running Linux you can turn off dither in nvidia 10xx series cards right?

Link Also dithering is such a faint flicker especially compared to say harsh led PWM flicker so things don’t add up when someone is sensitive to dither but completely fine with PWM.

I don't agree with this because PWM is the entire displays backlight turning on and off regularly...dithering is each pixel flickering on its own and creates a lot more overall movement as you can see from the Dasung videos @degen took. Even a static screen is "moving" and wiggling and always in motion. I would say seeing every background, object, letter etc moving constantly and independently via dithering would be more difficult for focusing and strain than strobing of a lightsource. Even incandescent bulbs flicker and nobody is bothered by that. Now I am not saying PWM or strobing lights don't bother anyone...I hate visibly strobing lights...but I do disagree that it's obviously much worse than wiggly dithering.

I also don't think the 6/8/10 bit progression disqualifies this theory since we don't know if something similar to @deepflame's experience was happening before where apps/OS's were requesting certain performance or panels were just not recognizing or capable. That's my theory as to ancient CCFL laptops don't tend to bother us...they simply aren't capable of responding to the requests for dithering up to fancier graphics...of course it could also be that the older software people tend to use on those older devices aren't 'asking' either.

This will be easy to test once someone can comfirm a way to swtich dithering on and off. It's either going to be a clear relief or not. For me removing PWM was not a clear relief and while I wanted to believe it and tried to push through it, PWM free panels hurt just as much for me.

Link In my mind it's not about brightness wrt to dithering..its about movement. Watch @degen's videos. You can see movement everywhere because the E-ink panel makes it visible unlike an LCD. If you were reading a book where the white backround and black letters were always moving a little bit and changing shades even a little etc it would be tiring and hard to focus on. I think this is what dithering is like for us but on a much larger scale since even what looks like a solid white background is really a bunch of wiggly points rather than a solid area. Compound that with fonts, images, video etc its constant movement and that's exhausting for the eyes. All that wiggling, movement, changing of colors etc are not obvious to the naked eye but are straining the visual system nonetheless. It's like "seeing" a solid white paper and when zooming in realizing its thousands of maggots crawling all over each other. We may not recognize that movement when zoomed out, but the eye muscles and brain do and are filtering it. We are already filtering out so much when looking at LCDs on a macro scale that this might just be the straw breaking the camel's back.

Obviously this is entirely speculation, the dithering IS there but it might not bother us at all...or it might be the root cause and all the other stuff like PWM/eye accomodation etc are just additive factors or triggered by it. People were positive PWM was the root cause as well. But we need to rule this out if nothing else and there isn't any other obvious theory that at present doens't have a definitive way to test.

deepflame I am no expert here but as he also thought the graphics card changes its graphics mode and enables dithering. I would suspect it is the color depth...

From another non-experts point of view it DOES seem a logical theory. And since we are never going to get every manufacturer and software maker to agree to turn dithering off or give us a switch...it seems tricking things into believing the needs can be met without dithering is the onloy sweeping approach possible. You have a reproducable relief within those apps...now we need to figure out how to get the OS to react like the apps and make this a system wide trick. I don't know if this is a plausible idea or not...tricking things into believing they don't need dithering, vs somehow blocking it.

hpst Yeah, I think it makes sense as every manufacturer is about HDR, high contrast, sharpness bla bla... And I think the hardware cannot deliver this completely yet so they need to help with software voodoo like dithering.
(yes, blue light and PWM are their own things but I think that we are in the HDR aera now where dithering/FRC plays a big role).

JTL So is this in line with how you were working to stop dithering? Or if not a workable approach? Tricking the system into believing a higher quality panel is used so it doesn't think it needs to turn dithering on?