Urgent advice needed

mike Thanks! This is important information. Actually, I have noted that even covering my eye half a day, enables me to use both eyes the rest of the day. But it is always very difficult to know for sure.

Since the only symptom I get, is red, dry and irritated eyes, I can sometimes use e.g. a new laptop for a day and think it is OK, but then I take a look at the mirror are see that my eyes are bloodshot and watery. So all things that I try, might need several days if not weeks to be sure if it really helps.

Non-dominant patched. Mostly because the non-dominant has a corneal injury so I can see as well with it. (No, the injury is unrelated to this problem, problem started 15 years prior to the injury)

I tried the cycloplegic drops. My pupils were dilated and I could not focus properly to near distances for 36 hours.

My eyes where whiter than ever, but it seems that the drops somehow paralyzed the meibom glands, because my eyes felt really dry the whole time. But they were not red, as they would be otherwise.

This led me to try something unusual: My eyes have always gotten unusually red when consuming alcohol. I was thinking that this might be somehow related to the display irriataiton problem. I tried this by having a few beers. Lo and behold, my eyes did not get red at all. And I must say, my eyes get really disturbingly red when consuming alcohol, so much so that I get comments "have you been crying" or "Have you taken some drugs" when at the pub or so.

Now with the cycloplegic drops, my eyes remained clear.

So it seems that there is some sort of problem when focusing to displays, where there is always some flicker, even if PWM free. This same issues seems to be brought out by alcohol as well. So it seems that the eyes are having difficulties focusing or keeping the binocular vision aligned when under the influence of alcohol, which makes the muscles work extra hard, similarly when looking at displays that flicker, which produces the red eyes.

Has anyone else noted the same, that the redness or eye pain would be brought by alcohol also?

And please, I don't need any comments that "you should not use alcohol period, it is unhealthy" that is not the point here. My point is to understand what it is that causes the eye irritation and what could resolve or mitigate it.

My hypothesis remains that it is related to binocular vision and some sort of strabismus which is intensified by flicker and alcohol makes it even more difficult for the nervous system to maintain focus so that the stereo vision works.

cizeta Thanks. Yes, OLED has been a problem always. Though, interestingly I had Galaxy S2 7´-8 years ago and used it heavily without any strain. Before that I had a HCT LCD with PWM with strained my eyes immediately. Galaxy S3 was problematic after longer use.

The Rohto drops have Benzalkonium, which makes my eyelids swell and makes my eyes even more irritated. Many eye doctors have warned against using anything with benzalkonium preservative as it can cause an allergic reaction.

The non-dominant eye covering is working for me and my eye doctor even recommended it, as she is a leading strabismus expert and has multiple patients who have eye pain or migraines which resolve immediately with eye patching. So this definitely is not some unscientific BS, as an eye doctor also knows about it and recommends it.

I just have slapped what ever piece of tape to my glasses. Working remotely.

But I ordered MIN lens, to be fitted to my glasses. Lets you see my eye, but I cannot see trough it. Draws less atention, in case this condition sticks and I need to patch my eye at the office. Luckily its just reading glasses, so people do not pay that much attention

The first time I had this that caused all displays to irritate, it went away in 8 months and I was able to get back to the previous screens and even tolerated and OLED phone.

But after Covid some 3 months ago, it came back and now I'm back to using only my Lenovo x280 with both eyes without problems and then all other screens with a tape on my non dominand eye glass.

No solution. But e.g. Onyx Boox Palma I'm able to use fine and read books with the backlight on (or frontlight)

@pol0sho but great to hear that you have the same experience with the dilating eye drops.

I've tried to tell many eye doctors that this has nothing to do with dry eye. It is that the flickering light makes stereo vision to go awry and the ciliary muscles to contract all the time, untill the eyes become bloodshot. similarly the glands that produce moisture, are working overtime and then might tire and result is dry eye, but it is not resolved by lubricating drops, as the eyes are completely irritated by then.

I had huge relief with the paralyzing eye drop - I diluted them heavily, maybe 1/50 or so and then my focus was only slightly soft. I was able to see the screens but by eyes were not getting irritated or red.

But now nobody is brave enough to prescribe those drops anymore.

So untill they make screens like they did 10 years ago or e-ink improves

pol0sho

pol0sho Thanks for the reply Maxx, i believe you truly have more knowledge now after looking for a solution so long than many so called eye doctors… i have recieved a Hisense A9 e-ink phone yesterday, havent really had time to test if produces bloodshot eyes but i dont think so? you use with the max back/front light turned on with no problem? i was even scared of turning that light on.

*yes, the Palma light does not bother me at all. Curiously my Kindle 2022 is not usable with the light, can use it with other lights and daylight.

I 100% get your frustration with so many eye doctors, ive been countless times and last time i went he just said: dude your eyes are like that, nothing you can do, some people have red veiny eyes and thats it bahaha idiots.

*yes most doctors have difficulties understanding anything else than what reads in a book or was taught in med school. This problem is kinda like celiac disease before it as understood. But now we are at least 2 persons who have very similar and very logical and consistent problem. If there is PWM or temporal, dithering, eyes get bloodshot and the paralyzing drops fix the irritation and redness.

So no blue light, operating system, brightness whatnot variables, only flicker

All my screen devices are flicker free and ive tested them with 1/4000 shutter speed to confirm so i dont think its the flicker for us, also you dont get headaches right? i never have headaches, maybe just a bit dizzy from 8 hours on pc but nothing serious, i read many people with headaches have flicker sensitivity.

*No, I don't ever get headaches. I of course can't say for your case, but for me it is 100% flicker. PWM or temporal dithering. I have confirmed this over and over again. I also don't seem to be sensitive to any variations of OS or driver if it does not produce temporal dithering.

*You should try to get Lenovo x280 used and make sure that it is the display version with 1080 ja that it does have PWM at less than 100.

As for monitors i work in a real estate as video/photography editor and many other roles such as website maintenence and marketing so im fucked, i wish i could just study for car mechanic haha.

*you. should be able to get an old Samsung or similar LCD display and connect the Lenovo to it. I don't have any strain with that combo, but now enev television is unwatchable without pathcing.

I really hope if we quit screens one day we will be able to get healthy eyes again.. ive had this shit for 15+ years but i guess since its a biological problem cells will be able to adapt to non screen and heal.

*My eyes recover in one day to normal. I mean they are never as white as they were when I was 15, or after the paralyzing eye drops, but they don't feel irritated.

*if I use a PWM screen, my eyes are in one hour like I'd cried my eyes out have a bad hangover.

*Also, my eyes tend to get really red if I drink alcohol, so much so that I often get asked in if I have done drugs or have cried.

I see there is an e-ink color monitor now of 25 inches from Dasung but as you know the refresh rate sucks balls so not a solution any time soon…

I see that you do taping your non domating eye, how did that work for you the first time you tried it? in how many days did you see an improvement in eye whiteness from fully blown red after puting the tape on ? i tried taping one day but gave up after a day of trying because i didnt see much improvement but maybe i gave up to soon? and your eyes are fully white when taping and using any screen you want? when taping your eye has to be fully closed of from any light coming in from above or i can just take my glasses and has more to do with the eye just not joining the other to look at the screen?

*I'm patching even now as I'm writing this on my OLED phone. It helps immediately, I mean, I sleep one night then just patch and then my eyes are not irritated. I have no idea as to why last time after months of patching my eyes recovered. By recovering I mean to the previous state that I was able to tolerate non temporal dithering and PWM screens fine and watch televisions without PWM fine.

Do you also have the sensation that lights in big Malls or comercial places that use flourecent lights or at night at a bar with bright other type of lights, if you used screens the whole day that day, that the redness exagerates in those settings as if its a delayed reaction cause the eyes are so fried from whole day on pc?

*I do notice flickering overhead led lights easily and find then irritating as there is the strobo effect, but I don't seem to be getting any eye strain from those. I even can do DIY work with a Led flood light that flickers 100hz.

Sorry for so many questions but you seem to be the only person ive read online since forever who could help me.

*there should be a combo like Lenovo x280 or similar, I don't think there is any magic to x280, but just the same chipset and then a panel that does not have temporal dithering or PWM at 100% that you should be able to use without discomfort.

then a combination of LCD and E-ink screen and patching. An maybe your eyes also improve from pathcing like many other and mine did. I'm now waiting for mine to improve again, but it's been only 3.5 months and I'm quite used to this now, I just always slap a piece of PostIt sticker to my glass when I'm using my phone or watching tv. I can work fine with the Lenovo x280. Then read books and do a bit of msg and twitter with the Palma.