Seeking Tolerable Gaming Monitor! Any thoughts welcome

boomhedshot

Thanks for the comments sir, and for the recommendation on the 75 Hz Samsung LF24T350FHRXEN. I've tried ALL settings and color profiles, in 30+ monitors now, and have tried narrowing down LED types or coatings by panel #, all largely to no avail. For me it seems to be something about the LED backlight itself causing my issue.

Update: Unfortunately the Asus Tuf VG27AQA1A is not going to work for me. It does still cause the eye pain and strain symptoms- though not as quickly as some other monitors. The hunt continues.

boomhedshot

Your comments on polarization direction are fascinating sir. So far the following is just a very small amount of anecdotal data but: I just took an old polarizing filter off my camera lens and determined my acceptable monitor is polarized differently than a monitor I have here that bothers me!- and both are polarized different than my acceptable TV. I will be doing some more extensive testing with this and will revert here. Thank you so much for the idea, you may be onto something! (And if so I will also be reaching out to MariusDA on the Reddit post to thank him profusely as well!) Stay tuned…

So, I ran around with a circular polarizer filter and examined a bunch of screens from both categories (both those that I can use for hours a day without a problem, and those that cause me painful eye strain and other symptoms with minimal use). Unfortunately, I found examples of each in all three categories, so I do NOT think polarization is my issue. Below are some examples. The items I list as "GOOD" below are screens I can use all day without an issue, the items I list as "BAD" cause my terrible eye strain with minimal use:

Horizontal polarization: Dell P2014HT 19.5" monitor (GOOD); Motorola One 5G Ace cell phone (GOOD); Samsung LED backlit TV Model UN55TU8000FXZA (GOOD); Sony X85K 43" TV (BAD)

45° polarization: Asus VS247H-P 24" monitor (GOOD); Asus VG248QG 24" gaming monitor (BAD)

Vertical polarization: 2022 Chromebook (GOOD); MSi Optix G273QPF 2022 27" gaming monitor (BAD); a couple other modern gaming monitors I tested (BAD)

Just an update: I purchased the BenQ TK700STi gaming projector (a DLP 4K projector), which uses a lamp bulb as the light source. Since this has no LEDs involved, I figured it wouldn't be a problem- but I was definitely mistaken- this projector definitely caused my eye strain symptoms as well! Since this projector uses pixel shifting to accomplish 4K resolution (like almost all 4K projectors), and since it's DLP (flashing red/ blue/ green can be seen with eye movement), I am now back to strongly suspecting my main issue, like many of us here, is dithering or flickering. (I know PWM doesn't personally bother me as my main tolerable 10 year old monitor uses PWM, but some type of pixel dithering or perhaps even light source flicker itself must be my main problem!)

So, despite my disappointment the BenQ TK700STi projector didn't work out, at least this is helping me narrow down the problem. Despite being so widely thwarted (I've tried something like 32 monitors now!), the hunt optimistically continues!

Sunspark

If your concern is genuine: Over a period of 6 years sir.

For a long time I dismissed temporal dithering or other pixel dithering as my issue. I dismissed it because:

• The Asus VS247H-P monitor from 2013 that I can use all day without an issue is 6 bit + FRC = uses temporal dithering. It also uses PWM. (I’ve tested and confirmed the PWM but technically haven’t test-confirmed the TD.)

• I have experienced discomfort with an offending monitor when it is on with black screen/ no signal to monitor, but backlight on.

• I have experienced the same symptoms from an LED desk lamp!

This led me to believe the LEDs themselves were somehow causing my eye strain.

However, I am now reconsidering temporal dithering or other flicker as being the primary cause due to the following:

• I tried the BenQ TK700STi DLP projector that uses a lamp (not LED!), and it definitely triggered the symptoms. It uses pixel shifting/ flickering (at 240 Hz) to achieve 4K resolution. Also as a DLP projector, I could also easily see the flashing red/ green/ blue “ghosts” of white objects as I moved my eyes quickly.

• In offending monitors I’ve always noticed two subjective observations about the color:

  • I’ve noticed that the colors just look “not solid” to me. No matter how I tweak the color settings, I can’t get them to feel “solid.” (Meanwhile my 2013 Asus VS247H-P 6 bit + FRC monitor does NOT feel like this to me; the colors feel solid.)

  • No matter how I tweak the color settings in the offending monitors, the discomfort persists: however, the “quality” of the feeling/ discomfort does change with color settings change. This implies to me that the monitor may be implementing different dithering with the color settings changes.

Has temporal dithering changed over time? Is there some other kind of flicker present in almost all modern monitors and TVs, that is not present in most phones and handheld devices?

Just thinking out loud in case anyone has any input. I very much appreciate all ideas!

boomhedshot

I tried this- it didn't help, but thank you so much for the suggestion!

I tried the HP X27i recommended by Aquila, but unfortunately it did NOT work for me- I could tell within 10 seconds it was causing that burning sensation in my retinas! I did play around with all the settings- it's a great monitor and I could get the color very stable looking. But after playing around for only 10 minutes I was relieved to put it back in the box.

Aquila The input doesn't make a difference for me, unfortunately!

Fakir35 In my own case I can use the Asus VS247H-P 24" monitor all day without strain, it is my main monitor that I'm using right now and have been using for the past 10 years. Three points to consider though: (1.) It is 6 bit + FRC (FRC = temporal dithering!- gasp!); (2.) I've tested it myself and it does use Pulse Width Modulation to control brightness (PWM- gasp!); and (3.) It simply doesn't have gaming monitors specs- it's a basic 60 Hz 24"TN panel with no VRR. That being said, it functions just fine, the response time is probably 1-2 ms. Interestingly, the fact that this monitor uses a form of temporal dithering and PWM has always made me discount flicker as being my main issue, however, after having a painful recent experience with a 4k pixel-shifting DLP projector that uses a lamp (no LEDs at all!) but does flicker, I'm wondering if newer LED backlights have some other kind of inherent imperceptible flicker. Also I've experienced an LED desk lamp that caused the same exact symptoms- so I'm wondering if maybe the LEDs themselves now pulse in some way that they didn't use to.