I think I was about 50% brightness and 40% contrast.
Windows won't let me download the file - it says there is a virus. Hopefully these Lupin screenshots are good enough for you.
Here's new screenshots at 100% brightness and 100% contrast.
…and 0% brightness and 0% contrast.
Here is virustotal scan:
As you see this file is clean. You said you don't like the radex because of simply one number, well the program can give most same as PC app, but it even shows full bandwidth of 3000Hz. Just use firefox to download not IE, or chrome. Or disable windows defender crap.
Here is how it looks like, you said you like graphs well it shows it all, but if you do not want to help yourself then its not my problem. Language can be english selected.
GregAtkinson I ordered one. I appreciate all your effort on this, and I’ll plan to report back with results.
Possible reservations I considered were, 1) usually I prefer 1080p screens at around 23”-24” (but, perhaps larger pixels can be easier for the eyes to focus on, so worth a shot), and 2) I think my personal issues are more related to modern LED backlights (with the red hue, in almost all the screens I tried), as well as software/driver causes, versus hardware-related flickering. Still, your testing seems promising, and I am happy to explore this further.
One bit of good news is that these monitors are very consistent in terms of flicker (the serial numbers are nearly sequential). Here's a screen shot of the monitor I'll be sending to @macsforme. It's 30x zoom on a white background, which is pretty much identical to the other monitor I tested from this batch.
And here's the worst color I could find (#D0D0D0)
Is there a higher frequency, too? The lines look kinda jagged. Did you measure that frequency? It may become more pronounced if using a time unit lower than the depicted 10 ms per div.
KM Good question. The other frequency is the backlight, I assume. This is at 100x zoom. You can see two lower frequencies. One every 25 us (40khz) and one every 3 us (330khz)
Have you heard about hybrid PWM? Dell U2713H (2012) can use two types of flickering at the same time. Up to 50% of the brightness flickers with a frequency of 1000Hz (every 25ms). At brightness 20-50% hybrid (double) PWM. Second flicker at 11500Hz frequency (every 285ms). Dell U3219Q (2018) also flickers every 250/5ms. One flicker is low-frequency, the second high-frequency. At the same time, monitors are declared as Flicker Free. The information was taken from the TFT Central and Prad.de sites
The frequency converter here tells me that 1000 Hz is a flicker every 1ms
https://www.unitjuggler.com/convert-frequency-from-Hz-to-ms(p).html?val=1000
GregAtkinson i ordered one yesterday! Good to explore ebay as a way to solve the logistics problem of getting the tech in front of more of us. Reagan
reaganry Nice! Thank you for giving it a shot. I put it in the mail this morning.
GregAtkinson I read a couple places that this monitor supports 167 colors. I assume that means 167 out of a possible 256.
Whoops… I just realized that 167 means 16.7 million… (And according to Display Specifications, it's 6 bits + FRC.)
I've been thinking about what a few people have been saying about refresh rates, temporal dithering/FRC, screen size, etc.
I had tested about 100 monitors and I took screen shots of the ones that had OK flicker. There ended up being 19 monitors with OK flicker. In other words, if you're willing to put up with a bit more flicker for a faster refresh rate or a true 8-bit panel, then this list could be useful.
| Manufacturer | Model # | Refresh | Color depth | Resolution | Screen size | Response time |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Samsung | U28R55 | 60Hz | 8-bit + FRC | 3840 x 2160 | 28 | 4 ms |
| HP | M27h FHD | 75Hz | 6 bit+ FRC | 1920 x 1080 | 27 | 5 ms |
| LG | 27UP600 | 60Hz | 8-bit + FRC | 3840 x 2160 | 27 | 5 ms |
| Samsung | S27BG40 | 240Hz | 8-bit | 1920 x 1080 | 27 | 1 ms |
| HP | M27h | 75Hz | 6 bit+ FRC | 1920 x 1080 | 27 | 5 ms |
| HP | M24h | 75Hz | 6 bit+ FRC | 1920 x 1080 | 24 | 5 ms |
| Dell | s2422hz | 75Hz | 6 bit+ FRC | 1920 x 1080 | 24 | 4 ms |
| LG | 24mq450-B | 75Hz | 6 bit+ FRC | 1920 x 1080 | 24 | 5 ms |
| LG | 27mq450-B | 75Hz | 6 bit+ FRC | 1920 x 1080 | 27 | 5 ms |
| LG | 29wp50s | 75Hz | 6 bit+ FRC | 2560 x 1080 | 29 | 5 ms |
| LG | 32up83a | 60Hz | 8-bit + FRC | 3840 x 2160 | 32 | 5 ms |
| Philips | 45b1u6900ch | 75Hz | 8-Bit | 5120 x 1440 | 45 (curved) | 4 ms |
| MSI | g271cp | 165Hz | 8-Bit | 1920 x 1080 | 27 | 1 ms |
| MSI | g321cu | 144Hz | 8-bit + FRC | 3840 x 2160 | 32 (curved) | 4 ms |
| Lenovo | g32qc-30 | 165Hz | 8-Bit | 2560 x 1440 | 32 | 1 ms |
| Lenovo | q27h-10 | 75Hz | 8-Bit | 2560 x 1440 | 27 | 4 ms |
| Acer | EI322QUR sbmiipphx | 165Hz | 8-Bit | 2560 x 1440 | 32 | 1 ms |
| AOC | Cq32g3su | 165Hz | 8-Bit | 2560 x 1440 | 32 | 1 ms |
| Dell | SE2422H | 75Hz | 6 bit+ FRC | 1920 x 1080 | 24 | 5 ms |
qb74 You could also use Rtings' tests for monitor flicker, which is pretty reliable
https://www.rtings.com/monitor/tests/motion/image-flicker
Now that I look closer at the site, I shouldn't have dismissed it so quickly. If you really look at the waveform closely, you can see whether it flickers or not. Here's a good example that I took from their site that doesn't seem to flicker:
https://www.rtings.com/monitor/reviews/asus/rog-strix-xg27aq
I kinda got thrown off by the fact that nearly all of their monitors receive a rating of 10 for flicker (10 being the best). But if you ignore their numerical rating and look very closely for a perfectly flat, thin waveform, you could probably find a flicker-free monitor that way.
The RTings site has a suggestion board. I created a discussion about how they could provide more detailed flicker graphs.
Here's the link. If everyone comments and likes I bet we could get their attention.
https://www.rtings.com/discussions/bxSoNXRO-ChZGzW3/detailed-flicker-graphs
You bought an LG 27GL650F-B (8bit) monitor, what's next?
Want to know how "response time" affects pixel flickering?
The backlight will flicker if you turn on MBR (black frame insertion)
My return window is closing soon so I'm going to return all unsold monitors on Friday morning. Order by EOD Thursday if you want one.
I bought a true 8-bit monitor just to see if I could tell a difference between that and 6-bits+FRC. It a fairly inexpensive monitor ($228). It's a Lenovo Q27h-10. 27", true 8-bit (according to https://www.displayspecifications.com/en/model/01a62201). 75hz max frequency.
The flicker is about 1.4% using the formula (max-min)/max. It's in the top 10 (out of about 100 monitors tested) in terms of low flicker.
This screen shot is 100x zoom, 100% brightness and 30% contrast.
I haven't used it yet (I have a bit of a headache today), but I'll report back in the next week or so.
GregAtkinson Another thing Rtings is good at is to look for response times charts. Certain trainsitions / colors may flicker as well.
Such as this VA panel during a rise transition (from darker to lighter shade)
This sawtooth wave u can see in the scope is very likely related to the scanline logic, a brightness dip happening every refresh cycle due to it (180hz = 5.5ms)
This is measured with a 12bit scope + thorlabs photodiode.
I wouldn't be surprised if this is the issue you're experiencing on the monitors you've tested.
qb74 I wouldn't be surprised if this is the issue you're experiencing on the monitors you've tested.
Yeah, I've seen a lot of waveforms like that. I zoom in 100x so the waveforms are a lot easier to see. That particular monitor would likely not work for me due to the noisy waveform and sawtooth pattern. Eyeballing it, it looks like the flicker is about 5% or so.
