Currently switching out my Mateview 28.2 as it is causing some eye strain. I much prefer having a high PPI for coding. As far as I'm concerned I have major issues with Iphone 15 Pro Max, and some problems with most IPS screens as text starts to glow rather fast. Currently my eyes are mostly fine these days as long as I don't do anything stupid, so it is slightly harder to figure out what monitor to keep. Hope some others here have also tried out of the few more promising high PPI monitors, so I can save some time figuring it out. Just returned Gigabyte M32UC . A curved VA monitor with edge lightning 4k32". Mainly because the picture wasn't that good, and it got the IPS text glow, even tho it was an VA monitor. Also the build quality was pretty bad. Not to be confused with the much more common IPS monitor Gigabyte M32U . Currently testing the LG UltraGear 32GS95UE . A rather expensive new WOLED panel with little blur and supposedly a true 10 bit panel. It's fine, but I do get eye strain, and tbh the picture isn't as pleasant to look at as I would like. It gets the typical glow around black text on white backgrounds, and the M1 Max can't drive it at more than 144hz, so I can't test if the 240hz framerate makes any difference. Tbh I don't really know what might be the best path anymore. Some of my wants are below: 220 ppi like retina screens. Mostly only achievable with the Studio Display. Dell also has a 6k panel, but obviously only with 60 hz, and somewhat crappy reviews. 240 hz. Not achievable with higher than 4k monitor, and not with this machine. Truly glossy screen. I hate the matte reflections in the LG and Huawei . There is one that seems promising called Alogic Clarity Max , but I know nothing about the panel, and it's hard to get here. Curved screen. At 32" the angle of the sides of the monitor are starting to annoy me. Avoiding KSF phosphor? Avoiding all forms of miniled backlight Considering just doing 2 x 27" monitors, as the PPI is worse on the 32" Did anyone have any success with 4k monitors?

@async Most of the panels you've tried are KSF phosphor The Mateview and M32UC are, at least. AMOLED phones are a completely different hazard, plagued with: PWM flicker, ghosting (due to slower G2G, for battery life apparently), brightness dip/flicker. Sorry to read that your WOLED journey was unfruitful., the OLED desktop monitor space is not ripe yet sadly. You might want to keep an eye out for the RGB stripe OLEDs in Q1-Q2 2026, which might be the holy grail of displays if they fix the current issues with them (subpar pixel layout on Windows, subtle brightness dip, lack of glossy/matte options) High PPI and higher refresh rates (+200hz) are only possible by going with a laptop-sized display for now. You have to choose one or the other in today's market, if talking about monitors. If you don't mind buying a entirely new machine: the new Blade 18 (4k 200hz) or some 16" 16:10 QHD 240hz panel in gaming laptops (such as the Asus Zephyrus lineup) should hit a few bulletpoints you've mentioned. But I'm unsure whether they sport a QDEF or KSF phosphor backlight (i'm afraid they both use KSF phosphor, no reviews to confirm anything) This 18.4" 4k 60hz Uperfect can also be an option, if you wanna give up on refresh rate and like smaller form factor (idk if KSF): https://www.uperfectmonitor.com/products/18-inch-4k-monitor I'd avoid the Alogic, due to sketchy company, potentially KSF phosphor and still too low PPI imo (+ the 60hz makes it really archaic, there are better options if u wanna give up on refresh rate) If you wanna opt for high PPI (+200), just get a used iMac 2013-2015 (21.5" 4k or 27" 5k) and install Windows/Linux on it and use it to your liking. Or try finding a iiyama XB2779QQS (uses iMac 27" panel but w/ single DP1.4, very unique out of the 5k panel clones) A nice, budget middleground is the Q24G2A (24" QHD 165hz) , as it lacks KSF phosphor and is decently fast.

qb74 Thank you! Extremely helpful reply. My perfect computer ecreen would actually look like the glossy iPhone Pro Max display without the eye strain. As yous ay the only viable path might be to use a few smaller monitors. Still waiting to get a reply from Uperfect. Not sure if anyone tested the Apple Studio Display with Stillcolor yet. Recent testing seems to make my iPhone just fine with the double invert trick that kills high gamut colors, so I guess testing something without KSF phosphor could be just as important.

Relevant article https://jarosz.medium.com/finding-the-best-portable-monitor-a3d582b7ea6f Can't seem to find a single 4k portable above 60hz. Stacking a few of those 200hz laptop panels together would be amazing.

Upon further extensive research, this is the lineup of monitors (YAG phosphor aka standard WLED backlight) I've accumulated: 1.) 1080p +200hz section has plentiful of options thankfully (if anyone wants, I can list them) 2.) 1440p +100hz, you got the following: AOC Q24G2A (another review - shows SPD & good ufo) (24" 165hz IPS) HP X27q (27" 165hz IPS) HP Omen 27q (27" 165hz IPS, seems to be new model of above display? there's 2 panels being used under the same model name - LG & BOE so it's panel lottery :/) (2nd review - uses KSF 🙁) Viewsonic OMNI VX2728J-2K (27" 180hz IPS) LG 27GS75Q (maybe "ksf-enhanced", but milder than most I've found, 200hz IPS, i'd argue it's not ksf but YMMV.) Omen X 27 (only 240hz 1440p LCD panel thats WLED backlight, TN) Gigabyte GS27Q (1440p 180hz LCD, WLED backlight, IPS) Old displays which you cannot buy anymore (144-165hz) Acer Predator XB271HU (IPS) PG279QZ (IPS) Dell S2716DG (TN) S2417DG (TN) Dell S2719DGF (TN) 3.) There are no 4k +60hz WLED monitors on the market right now, sadly. It's strictly KSF or QDEF

Decent 4k/5k/6k monitors. What options are there?

photon78s

qb74

What are you insights with Eizo's. I've tried the CG2700X with no success eyestrain wise due wide color gamut and other factors.

Here is the spectrum I measured for the 16:10 QHD 240Hz legion 7i 2023 panel. I think this is KSF phoshor?

async

I tried and gave up on the multiple high refresh panel approach with a couple uperfect 2k 16:10 144hz panels. I've built a diy monitor with a WQHD laptop panel. The driver board I'm using supports 144hz 4k so in theory could be used to implement a multiple high refresh rate laptop panel system using panels pulled from gaming laptops.

simplex

photon78s with a WQHD laptop panel

great news, which panel you try?

I still not sure regarding KSF phosphor impact

qb74

photon78s
I haven't delved into professional monitors such as Eizo at all, due to their low refresh rate so I'm unaware of what they're doing nowadays.

Yes, that specific SPD graph is the typical KSF phosphor one, easily spotted by the sharp red peaks.
This confirms my suspicion of new high refresh rate laptop panels using KSF too.

Funny coincidence, I was actually on the lookout for that particular driver board too. There's another version with the miniDP port which came to my attention.
What panel have you paired with the controller board and does it support overdrive tuning?
Could you detail your build?

async

photon78s interesting. Where did you find info about sourcing panels? I guess it could be a lot of hit or miss.

https://www.reddit.com/r/PcBuild/comments/16xo7yd/show_you_guys_two_diy_4k_highrefreshrate_portable/

madmozg

async Today I wanted to try with BetterDisplay at apple store, but the app need admin permissions 🙁 was not able to test it in store.

photon78s

simplex

B140QAN02.0

https://ledstrain.org/d/2589-products-to-try-or-avoid-pwm-flicker-and-temporal-dithering-testing/310

should work with some 17 inch 4k panels panels as stated on the product listing page.

I'm using it for a diy solar backlit display. Seems to work well for that case as well.

qb74

Upon further extensive research, this is the lineup of monitors (YAG phosphor aka standard WLED backlight) I've accumulated:
1.) 1080p +200hz section has plentiful of options thankfully (if anyone wants, I can list them)
2.) 1440p +100hz, you got the following:

AOC Q24G2A (another review - shows SPD & good ufo) (24" 165hz IPS)
HP X27q (27" 165hz IPS)
HP Omen 27q (27" 165hz IPS, seems to be new model of above display? there's 2 panels being used under the same model name - LG & BOE so it's panel lottery :/) (2nd review - uses KSF 🙁)
Viewsonic OMNI VX2728J-2K (27" 180hz IPS)
LG 27GS75Q (maybe "ksf-enhanced", but milder than most I've found, 200hz IPS, i'd argue it's not ksf but YMMV.)
Omen X 27 (only 240hz 1440p LCD panel thats WLED backlight, TN)
Gigabyte GS27Q (1440p 180hz LCD, WLED backlight, IPS)

Old displays which you cannot buy anymore (144-165hz)
Acer Predator XB271HU (IPS)
PG279QZ (IPS)
Dell S2716DG (TN)
S2417DG (TN)
Dell S2719DGF (TN)

3.) There are no 4k +60hz WLED monitors on the market right now, sadly. It's strictly KSF or QDEF

photon78s

qb74

B140QAN02.0 (60hz)

My post above mentioned the panel model along with link to measurements of it prior to removing the backlight (backlight removal process from here). I am using the controller with the 0.5 mm pitch 40 pin cable version connected to the laptop panel. Plug and play from there using a usb-c to full size display port cable. Using an incandescent maglite flashlight as backlight, I measure Ra value of 80 and the spectrum below. I don know if it supports overdrive tuning. The controller board has printed on it "DP-EDP V8.3". This board should work with better and higher refresh rate panels but the one I'm using was pulled from my T480 laptop so was convenient for testing.

photon78s

async

Now that is true dedication to DIY especially making the enclosure! Doesn't look "diy". Right now, I have the screen simply mounted to a plastic sheet with a thick bottom bezel part to have space to attach the board and to prevent the panel electronics and ribbon cables from flexing.

Sourcing panels is definitely hit or miss but reddit, panelook, and just searching on replacement panels using their model names or combining name of the laptop + "replacement panel" as search terms has been helpful. This started as simply trying to find better internal display for T480. Some things I've learned:

The various types of internal lcd panel cables for the T480 do not fit this driver board. This why I bought the version of the board with included cable. They seem to be custom for the laptop motherboard but look like they fit.
You have to make sure pin sizes and pin count match obviously. The current 40 pin board's cable does not fit FHD display panels which uses 30 pin connector. I know pin adapters exist. Haven't tried them and heard they are unreliable.
I've read about some incompatibilities with low power IGZO displays.
The framework pc community can be helpful for DIY.

madmozg

I'm currently looking at this monitor - 40inch 5K monitor 120hz. It's flicker free. https://www.dell.com/en-us/shop/dell-ultrasharp-40-curved-thunderbolt-hub-monitor-u4025qw/apd/210-bmdp/monitors-monitor-accessories

But I have 2 concerns before buying it for tests:

It's 8bit + A-FRC - https://www.delltechnologies.com/asset/en-us/products/electronics-and-accessories/technical-support/dell-ultrasharp-40-curved-thunderbolt-hub-monitor-u4025qw-cvaa-datasheet.pdf
Will I be able to use it only in 8bit mode without FRC with BetterDisplay app connected to macbook with apple silicon.

Any suggestions? I Also can't find any info about this new method of A-FRC.

async

Some observations with 32" UltraGear™ OLED Dual Mode 4K UHD 240Hz for whoever is considering it on Mac.

Somewhat starting to like it, and after a ton of adjustments I don't really get much eye strain, but it's pretty far from perfect. The WOLED pixel layout is fine, but absolutely not perfect.

Running at true retina will end up as a giant sized UI due to the 32" size, that looks like 1080p. Worthless for coding and surfing the web.
Running scaled resolutions will add a ton of artifacts that can be pretty annoying, unless the PPI is higher. If someone has a fix for it I really want it. I've searched for it previously in the Stillcolor thread. Strange outlines/visual artefacts in UI elements when using a scaled resolution | MacRumors Forums
M1 Max can only run 144 hz with an USB-C to DisplayPort 1.4 cable. HDMI is not an option. Supposedly M2 Max can do 240.
I never want to use anything less than 144 hz again. It's way better. However I do think for certain screens that are a bit smudgy it doesn't really matter with 60hz. I would guess that having zero blur with a low refresh rate is worse than having a really good monitor with low refresh rate. At least for me this monitor requires using an app like MOS to have proper smooth scrolling. Choppy scrolling at high HZ seems rather painful tbh.
On the display it is possible to display DSC (Display Stream Compression). Doing so limits the refresh rate to 120. Supposedly DSC doesn't introduce artifacts. Didn't test enough, so I stuck with 144.
HDR is only available up to the scaled resolution that looks like 1440p or something, as well as the native non retina ones.
With BetterDisplay you can add scaled resolutions at any size, however anything above 160% scaling will limit the screen to 95hz. Probably requires too much processing power, as the image sent to the monitor is the same.
The anti-reflective coating is supposedly good, but I just see a bunch of grainy reflections.
Obviously the lack of blurring, true blacks and everything is exceptional.

Right now I would actually like some 3:2 monitors with high refresh rate. I think 32" isn't really an option as things get blurry pretty fast, and keeping it closer ends up with excessive head movement.

madmozg

async ohh, I returned this monitor after an hour I got it lol. It gave me craziest eye strain in a while after just 10 minutes, and till the end of the day I was done 🙁

async

Tested quite a bit. There is massive flicker on grays. Even with adaptive sync turned off, and at all refresh rates, and all color modes. Variable refresh rate is not selected in Mac either. Not sure if it affects HDMI.

Somehow the image seems much more pleasant with DP 1.2 instead of DP 1.4 or DP 1.4(DSC). Tried all with the same color profile, as 60 hz. No idea tbh. Didn't find a quick way to check if Mac uses something else to process the signal for the old standard.

Anyway, I'm not keeping this.

photon78s

I keep DSC off and run at 120hz using DP on 4k 27 inch LG 27gp95r-b which still gives me strain. It is also nano ips. So-called Next generation of display technology. Not sure these approaches have improved consideration for eye health and many seem to be not viable for other reasons.

Some new stuff even mentions more dithering:

From tftcentral

This is a new feature for META 2.0. Detail Enhancer technology which “helps articulate subtle differences in natural brightness through pixel dimming for both light and dark areas to achieve richer image expression. Using dithering technology for every pattern position based on OLED pixel dimming technology it enhances colour accuracy and apparently also widens colour gamut. This allows the delivery of images with full-range HDR detail, accurately representing objects with distinct colours, true to the creator’s original intent.”

madmozg

photon78s Does it use PWM? As I see its utilizing FRC. Did you try using 8bit only mode with BetterDisplay ?

qb74

photon78s
Have you experimented with QDEF backlight LCD's? Or perhaps even WOLED / QD-OLED? (you probably know it's flaws, just mentioned them for the sake of it)

photon78s

madmozg

This is what I measured at both 0% and 100% brightness on white background. The flicker is very subtle as I need to use 20dB or more gain on the detector to measure this. Not the worse but not the best. My T480 B140QAN02.0 panel is better in this department.

I don't have mac anymore to test the new version software.

photon78s

qb74

Not yet. If I do, I will do my usual testing (oscilloscope, flicker, microscope pixel videos, color spectrum, polarization) and post.

async

Seems like people are really happy with the Espresso 17 Pro. Rather expensive, but with 4k at 17 inches you can run retina as intended. Might give it a try. If anyone tried it do tell.

espresso 17 Pro 4K Portable Monitor and Stand

espresso 17 Pro 4K portable monitor – glorious colour (computer review) - Cybershack

madmozg

Hey guys, I've just received a new monitor to test Dell U4025QW. It's a 40'' 5K display 8bit + FRC. Its not using mini-LED, looks like it's a dc-dimming mostly. 8bit + FRC tho. Going to do some tests, hopefully betterdisplay will help me with FRC. Let me know if you would like me to test anything specific.

async

madmozg Initial impression?

Flicker on solid gray areas?