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  • "100% sRGB" Color Gamut cause eye strain? headache? is it even possible?

Hello friend, first before I start my participation let me tell you that this is not my native language so there may be errors in the translation I am doing from another language.

I once bought a notebook with a 45% ntsc IPS screen (which I think is 60% srgb) and it caused me the same problem you mention, when I spent a moment using it I got an unbearable headache that I had never had before, not even due to lack of sleep or stress, it seemed as if my brain hurt, and my relatives when they saw the screen for a moment began to feel the same even when wearing glasses, the pain continued for a moment after we stopped looking at the screens. Afterwards, I tried one of those "ultra modern" ASUS OLED notebooks with blue light filter and it was an amazing experience, very pleasant UNTIL you start to scare your eyes with the infinite contrast, you just can't get your eyes used to such high contrast that it's practically the same as looking at the sun in high light moments, it really seems like a technology that surpasses the resistance of the human eye. I went back to my previous notebooks with TN and little by little when I got over the adaptation to blue light (OLEDs are yellowish light) it was like being home again, despite how old this notebook is (2014) and how cheap it was (approximately $200) the screen has always been incredible in brightness of 80 and since those bad experiences I had with other technologies, I have never wanted to separate myself from TN technology.

So, it seems to be the panel technology that is the problem and not the color capacity it has. I also have a very expensive IPS TV and the eye strain is less, but even so, the IPS brightness is quite a challenge if you are going to look at it continuously.

    After thinking about it over and over again, I'm coming to think that 60% sRGB color is enough, I've made comparisons with 100% sRGB and what happens is that no detail of the images and videos is lost, it's just compressed or turned off but the information is still there, comparing carefully I've come to the conclusion, even the clearest data of an image is still present in 60% sRGB, even the last bit of the reflection in the sea of ​​a sunset is there.

      All modern panels I tested, have aggressive vcom - technology to prevent pixel sticking

      You can download this 2 screenshots and play it in circle, to see pixel movement even in static image

      img1

      img2

      This modern feature overload my eye-nerve, increase eye-pressure, then it goes to pressure in temples, then migraine

        Many modern panels are outright unusable for me. I despise this contrast war. 4 years ago I tried updating my tv and had to return both a LG OLED and a Samsung LCD. They were both striving for HDR which is what I believe helped the downfall for many of us. Higher contrast and deeper color pallets are required for HDR. I want nothing to do with this brightness/contrast war.

        latir Hello friend, non-native English here too.

        I also think that maybe it's the technology that make my head hurt, but I also wonder why phones with IPS are good for me so far, Realme 9 Pro use IPS, previously using LG Q6 that is also IPS. After buying this laptop I also realize that my brother is using AMOLED screen but always have night filter on, if its off its hurting his eyes, my mother also using AMOLED and always need to set the brightness to the max to comfortably use it. At some point I start to believe this is genetic issue.
        I did try to stare at OLED screen on the store, my symptom still there, but the testing is so-so being tested in the store with all kinds of screen blasting every corner so it's not reliable.

        Actually, looking for gaming laptop with same spec but TN screen but it seems its nonexistent. Thinking about doing DIY replacement screen too, but still not found any compatible one. Also thinking about buying IPS 60% sRGB screen but I'm still not financially stable

          latir this too, when I bought this is I just feels like "why the hell not, why not buy the most decked out spec I could afford and use it for another 10 years" mindset is coming to me and I also never see 100% sRGB on a laptop before, so why not just buy this and also support local brand even if it's just a repacked Clevo.

          I see comparison of 100% and 60% and honestly, it's not that different too

            simplex like one of those OLED care Sofware? I think Asus have one for their OLED lineup where they shift the entire screen by a pixel every few second

                I also found out that most laptop in the range where I can afford it but still want performance is using the same or similar IPS 144hz 100% sRGB panel, which is sad

                • qb74 replied to this.

                  qb74 thank you, I'll look into it. Seems like laptop is absolute gacha for most of us huh

                  there is a mention of polarization in there but I think it's not the issue for me since my work ThinkPad have same polar direction as the bad screen I have, tested with polarized glasses too

                    The IPS I had was also 60% srgb but it still seems to have a very high intensity in the colors, the colors to navigate there are many strong colors distracting the attention and it is exhausting to be for hours with neon colors everywhere, not even something as simple as the task bar is free from that intensity no matter how you configure it, it seemed to come out of a toy store, all without exaggeration.

                    I think IPS cell phones also have the dreaded "ips brightness" but apparently because they are smaller screens they do not end up stressing the eyes, but I did notice that at maximum brightness my vision was at its limit and I needed to lower the intensity to about 20-30% to be able to look at it. I do not think it is a genetic problem, besides the fact that the eyesight is trained for one screen or another does not go through genetic factors. In my country I found $2000 gaming notebooks with TN screens, but according to the seller "the screens were very bad" and he recommended an OLED instead. How can I believe him? I've been using them all my life and with each one, no matter how different they were from one model to another, I have never had the problem that IPS has given me, nor have I had the discomfort of OLED contrast.

                    If you tell me you want it for gaming, well... the OLED I tried was incredible with PS2 emulators, even better than a tube TV, but sometimes there were glares that shouldn't appear at such a high intensity, and in PC games the color intensity was already starting to be a disaster, the image ended up looking fake in some RTS menus because of the color intensity, but with TN screens it really felt natural. I think in the end what you should miss the most are the deep dark and deep shadows

                      simplex ah, so it's like "hardware level tech" stuff, pretty new to this for me. All I know is the one from Asus that also prevent pixel stuck or sticking from static image

                          latir I also thought maybe pixel density is one of the causes since phone have bigger ppi, but then I realize my old safe screens is all 768p resolution. Even if I want to test it, 4K or 2.5K resolution laptop is mostly way higher than my budget

                          • qb74 replied to this.

                              I also thinking if color range is one of the causes but haven't found anyway to limit it via intel and since the laptop didn't have MUX switch or discrete only mode, I can't try out Nvidia limited color range mode. The laptop is hybrid and I believe all visual processing is always involving intel dGPU

                              Kanatarium All I know is the one from Asus

                              yep, you can find vcom tech data in panel datasheets only, I suppose

                                Kanatarium It's the opposite, higher PPI is always exclusively better. The culprit lies somewhere else.

                                A quick google search revealed to me that the panel you're using specifically has PWM on anything below 99% brightness, this is very likely what you're reacting to.
                                In general, even today, laptops can come with PWM dimming for brightness adjustments in lower frequency ranges (I'd avoid anything below 100kHz like the plague)

                                A general heads up for people reading this thread and forum members here, since people seem to shy away from advancements:
                                Never assume higher PPI and higher refresh rate are your issue

                                it's almost always some kind of flicker / brightness variance or something related to color spectrum / color gamut (unknown to me and many others as to what specific mechanism causes this flareup for people)

                                Also, do not result to eyepatching. It is a bandaid imo.

                                Take a look at UPerfect portable monitors (I'd recommend 16" 16:10 144hz QHD model, due to higher PPI nature or 18.4" 4k if you wanna sacrifice the refresh rate)

                                Also, please consider other factors contributing to overall health, such as diet and physical fitness.
                                Consider adding the following supplements:

                                • a proper O3 supplement w/ Astaxanthin (Life Extension),
                                • a proper eye health supplement (Macuguard from Life Extension),
                                • limiting wireless devices around you (EMF's contribute to a myriad of issues in the body)

                                Hope this helps.

                                    qb74 is this the Pongo 760 BOE or Asus x450J panel? the Asus one has PWM but I always set the brightness to the max since it's not that bright, so I never notice it

                                    now that you mention it, on reddit someone said that the same NV156FHM-N4K type can have PWM or no PWM based on the other serial number
                                    mine is NV156FHM-N4K (BOE08B3) based on HWINFO which based on this Gigabyte laptop review it didn't have PWM.

                                    I used my friend Z Fold 5 that have PWM on 45-degree orientation and as far as I remember, I don't feel any discomfort, at least the one that easily noticeable

                                    • qb74 replied to this.

                                        Kanatarium

                                        now that you mention it, on reddit someone said that the same NV156FHM-N4K type can have PWM or no PWM based on the other serial number
                                        mine is NV156FHM-N4K (BOE08B3) based on HWINFO which based on this Gigabyte laptop review it didn't have PWM.

                                        I haven't seen HWInfo be able to dispaly the panel model used, interesting. Could you take a screenshot?

                                        I used my friend Z Fold 5 that have PWM on 45-degree orientation and as far as I remember, I don't feel any discomfort, at least the one that easily noticeable

                                        There are many variables at play, such as: time spent looking at screen. brightness level (100% brightness is milder on OLED than lower brightness due to PWM) etc.

                                        Overall, one should consider the following too:

                                        • Overall brightness of display (100-150nits is nice in doors, more is not good imo but YMMV, try finding out overall brightness like this,
                                        • Ergonomics around you (lightblubs also flicker, good and sufficient enough ambient light behind screen which also doesnt flicker and the body position which you view the screen at is something to consider for display ergonomics),
                                        • Coating (matte / glossy - some people prefer one over the other),
                                        • SPD (some people dislike blue peaks or peaks such as KSF/QDEF),
                                        • Psychological/physiological factors (stress, lack of sleep, malnutrition)

                                        It's a matter of trial and error sadly, I can only give you a few guidelines.
                                        You could try and use a slowmo camera smartphone and eye-ball whether it flickers (samsung, sony and apple phones can be used, havent tried others)

                                            qb74 this model , I still didn't know how to embed image so I can just give imgur link

                                            Sadly, I already tried all the suggestions there except the SPD (?) i don't know what that is

                                            oh yeah, I also tested my friend monitor, Viewsonic XG2405, my symptoms also happens with that one

                                            • qb74 replied to this.
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