I think if we could identify what the issue is it wouldn't be hard to find a manufacturer willing to create a modern machine that uses known-good components (safe graphic card, non-IPS screen, no PWM, no dithering, polarisation tested, etc.) that could be sold as default device for persons wanting to protect their eyes. It's a niche, but I think it wouldn't be that small. Based on number of new devices being produced every year by Dell, Asus, Lenovo and others I guess there are more misses than hits, and this one would be guaranteed to stand out from the crowd and have precisely defined core target customers group.

    andc What's wrong with IPS displays? TN panels have crappy viewing angles. Ugh.

      JTL For a time I was convinced IPS was the culprit as I worked through the list of factors. It turned out it was just that all modern displays are IPS so it was coincidental as I have an IPS iPad 2 that's fine. I think since CCFL tends to TN and be on older stuff and older stuff seems less effected by whatever the problem is, it's natural to think the new tech is the problem. But when you drill down TN vs IPS is just the way the elements in the liquid crystals are turned with electricity so there is no logical reason why this sort of thing...IPS/TN/VA etc should matter. It's all just different sorts of window blinds when you get down to it...letting the light through. For a while I wondered if polarization angles mattered since IPS is always vertical or horizontal and TN on a 45/135 bias...but still can't make sense of that.

      JTL

      I'm one of the few people who can't use IPS screens in any form (phones, tablets or monitors), I think there might be one other on this forum, perhaps it was Andc?

      • andc replied to this.

        ryans I suppose the question is where to start, as at least in my case it's happening on Smart TV's/Games Consoles/PC's.

        I think almost everyone here would agree having a strain-free PC/Mac is the absolute #1 priority. Following that IMO would be Smart Phones, then Games Consoles and then Smart TV OS etc etc.

        So we'd need to contact the major players, Intel, Nvidia, AMD to at least get the driver side sorted out. If we can get a bonafide dithering-free GPU/Driver then that's a big part of the puzzle resolved. Next would be to analyse the OS itself, and contact Microsoft/Apple (sigh) for assistance. Following that, once we know a dithering/artifact free OS and GPU is in operation, the only remaining point of failure is the display itself, perhaps icc profiles/edid spoofing could fix that.

        To gain media attention is a different story. I know many are against reddit and other forms of social media but that is the platform of the masses. Facebook groups, reddit channel, even youtube channels in my opinion are essential to raise awareness of these problems. I'm not suggesting any clickbait tactics (Iphone XR made me blind 🙂).

        I'll - nominally, at least - participate in whatever campaign folks try to engage.

        Seagull I'm one of the few people who can't use IPS screens in any form (phones, tablets or monitors), I think there might be one other on this forum, perhaps it was Andc?

        It's not exactly me 😉 I can safely use some of the IPS screens (HTC 10, iPad) and majority of others cause some issues - some are horrible, others are "acceptable", ie. - I can stand them if I have to (like my work laptop which I use when I'm in the office), but I wouldn't use them for longer periods in my private time. I guess I'm not on the "extreme" side of the issue, but at the same time I'm worried for the future since my job relies heavily on computers.

        @JTL
        I'm not sure what's wrong with IPS, it might be coincidence caused by current technology as @hpst wrote, but for example CCFL TN screen is easier for my eyes than modern LED IPS on the same machine. I wouldn't be surprised if screen being IPS or not was something like 10-30% factor of overall strain assuming the issue is complex with things like our health, dithering, PWM, etc. playing some roles. With specific configurations this factor would not be enough to cause issues, but mixed with others it could cause problems. I rememeber someone saying sunglasses helped with eyestrain, maybe its polarised surface fixed whatever IPS is doing wrong.

          andc

          no worries,

          My IPS thing is weird, I can't use any of them, but I actually find modern IPS more tolerable, I can look at a co-workers new IPS for a few moments and not suffer, but there are older panels that cause me intense migraines. I bought a microscope a while back to investigate and found that the pixels on IPS panels can look quite different. The older ones are typically slanted, in an alternating pattern, whereas the modern IPS pixels look much more like TN pixels under the microscope.

          No idea how that correlates to my IPS problem, just thought it might interest you.

          My HTC 10 has subpixel grid similar to stairs, ie. they go up and down, I wondered if it has any effect on straining capabilities.
          If world wasn't so big we could make a meetup with all the good / bad devices of different kinds, all the stuff that we use to test them (oscilloscopes, microscopes, cameras, etc.) and try to find common properties of good devices and also check if good devices are ok for majority of us, or if it's totally dependent on specific person.
          Another option is to convince manufacturers to perform such tests on wider set of devices than the one made by Intel, but I guess it's also unlikely to happen.

          6 months later

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