Harrison
ensete
I agree that migraines can also come from health issues BUT if you don't have a migraine and then you watch TV, play a game on a LED monitor or enter a room that is only lit by LED lighting(or CFL) AND you get a migraine or dizzy then it is not your gluten intolerance that is causing this. What next? Are you guys going to convince us the earth is flat? Or maybe the zodiac has something to do with the fact that you get a headache from invisible flicker?

Please lets keep this as scientific as possible. There are a LOT of scientific papers regarding light flicker and invisible light flicker which causes a series of problems for humans and animals alike.

If you would like I can provide links to some of those scientific papers. Until then you should read this article(use automatic translation from Chrome, does a pretty good job):
https://www.elektroboerse-smarthouse.de/elektroinstallation/beleuchtung/artikel/138700/

For more you can go:
https://www.derlichtpeter.de/en/

Invisible flicker that is harmfull cannot be spoted even with a DSLR with 1/4000. Here is a toy that might help you spot it:
https://www.fauser.biz/li/lifli.htm

      martin Everybody is affected by invisible flicker. People like us either have better vision or we have eyes that are more sensitive to light flicker.

      All eyes get micro muscle contractions from light flicker, we are lucky that we also get headaches and we realize that something is wrong. You fix the invisible light flicker you loose the headache and you keep your 20/20 vision.

      Other people who don't get headaches don't care about this. They just loose their perfect 20/20 vision in a few years and think they lost it because they got older and not because of the light flicker.

          martin Genetic brain issue? You sound like you lost all hope!

          Not only there is hope but there are solutions. There are LED bulbs that don't give you headaches, monitors, smartphones etc.

          You just need the right tools to test these out. Subjective testing does not go a long way.

          Check this toy out:
          https://www.fauser.biz/li/lifli.htm

          • JTL replied to this.

              JTL I know. This toy seems to be easier to use. Maybe if we would all get one of these toys we could have a more scientific way to test our devices other than our own subjectivity. Also why wait until you get a headache when you can test with this?

                Has anyone tried amitriptyline for curing headaches? My doc might want to try it. I'd rather not, but I think several of us on here have recognized that some of our problems are likely neurological.

                • JTL replied to this.

                  ryans Sure. I did back in September 2014 and it was awful, suicidal thoughts, blurry vision (wasn't permanent) and feeling sleepy all the time.

                      JTL God that sounds terrible! Were you under the age of 25 when you tried it?

                      • JTL replied to this.

                          PuffyCloud I agree that there might be health consequences of flicker exposure over prolonged time, and that vision degeneration with aging might be caused by this. However that still does not explain why people like us also have headaches.
                          Yes we may be special in a way that we notice this compared to other people, but my vision is not perfect, I wear glasses, although corrected for right eye only. So we may also be people with neurological problems who get migraines from flickering light and certain wavelengths of LEDs, or both. Ideal solution is then to try to solve for your health, why also paying attention to the tech side, because there is a very large possibility that the lighting tech today is badly quality controlled.

                          The tool you posted is nice, but does not seem to show all that much. I started another thread here some time ago where its explained how to build your own oscope for cheaper than usual, and that might give more precise readings.

                          Ive contacted lightaware.org, theyre interested in me and maybe we could all do that and write them our stories, and make them and their influence grow.

                              martin Its not just people like us that are more sensitive are affected. And it is nothing at fault healthwise with us.

                              Check this out:
                              https://m.phys.org/news/2017-07-scientific-dont-bulbsand-simple.html

                              And this:
                              https://www1.essex.ac.uk/psychology/overlays/2013-207.pdf

                              Most people can detect up to 3000Hz flicker and more sensitive can detect up to 4900Hz.

                              Being able to spot up to 4900Hz doesn't make you less healthy. It is the other way around. Does being able to see more colors mean that you are sick?

                              But being able to spot up to 4900Hz does make you susceptible to headaches at higher flicker frequencies than regular people. For other people to get the same headache that you get you should reduce the flicker frequencies proportionally. So for example if you get migraines at 100Hz regular people would get the same migraines that you get at half that.

                              Also you should be aware that LED go directly to 0 brightness they don't have inertia like incandescents. And LED bulbs flicker at the same time at many different frequencies. Here is an example of the frequencies at which a very good performing LED flickers:

                                              @8 Hz: 0.000159 (-76.00 dB)
                @19 Hz: 0.000070 (-83.14 dB)
                @73 Hz: 0.000052 (-85.72 dB)
                @100 Hz: 0.000451 (-66.92 dB) ***
                @200 Hz: 0.000231 (-72.72 dB)
                @300 Hz: 0.000111 (-79.13 dB)
                @53001 Hz: 0.000051 (-85.91 dB)
                @66529 Hz: 0.000055 (-85.12 dB)
                @83056 Hz: 0.000052 (-85.75 dB)
                @170730 Hz: 0.000050 (-85.94 dB)

                              This bulb goes to 0 brightness for very short periods of time so it does not affect you. You can imagine that most of the bulbs that you can buy don't perfom as good as this one.

                              • JTL replied to this.
                              • JTL likes this.

                                  Has anyone tried medications that help? Klonopin? Meclizine?

                                  ShivaWind Have you tried any medications or glasses that help? Have you figured out what bothers you (PWM, dithering, colors, Intel Graphics)?

                                    JTL Lets take the first one:
                                    @8 Hz: 0.000159 (-76.00 dB )
                                    The light of the LED bulb goes to almost 0 brightness (has the amplitude of -76.00 dB ) and stays at almost 0 brightness for 0.000159 seconds at a frequency of 8 Hz( 8 times a second). But because it is a very short period of time it should not cause problems.

                                    The best LED bulbs stay dark for less then 0.00001 seconds at all flicker frequencies.

                                    @guys let me reiterate. There is nothing wrong with you healthwise. You are just able to spot higher frequencies of flicker than most people and that is why you get migraines. For most people to get the same problems that you and I are having you just need a LED bulb and flickers at lower frequencies that can be spoted by most people.

                                    There ARE light fixtures and LED bulbs that will not cause any problems. Also be AWARE that the bad input electricity can make a good flicker free LED bulb flicker and cause you problems.

                                    And just because something is marketed as flicker free it does not make it so. Almost anything that flickers at or above 100 Hz is marketed as flicker free(and that is a low enough frequencie to cause problems).

                                      The fact that most of the people on this forum DO NOT get migraines dizziness or other problems from incandescents is PROOF that there is NOTHING WRONG HEALTHWISE with none of them.

                                      Incandescents ARE NOT flicker free. They were supposed to be, because they were supposed to be used with DC electricity. They give light in a sine wave because of the heat inertia. Halogen bulbs have a more harsh flicker than normal incandescents because the wire is not as thick and there is lower inertia. LEDs have no inertia at all and there are few bulb driver design that give good quality light. This is why this forum exists. It would not exist if incandescents were still produced.

                                        dev