I have just got an X230 in the mail w/W7 Pro. It seems 'OK' to me although I have heard there is seriously bad PWM on the screens unless it is on full brightness. Maybe software like Iris could fix that? Getting a mdp>hdmi converter so will try it out on my monitor.

Also aren't the BIOS on Thinkpad's usually notoriously locked down? I thought most flashing tools have to show some sort of disclaimer to avoid responsibility for bricking the device if the flash fails?

  • Gurm replied to this.

    So I've now connected the X230 to my U2414h and am getting strain 🙁. (ditherig switched on and using 2012 driver)

    One thing I have noticed is the Thinkpad BIOS is a post W10 2015 version. The original BIOS for the X230 was released in May 2012.

    AFAIK the Intel Integrated VBIOS version is dependent on the motherboard BIOS - so a downgrade may work?

    This wasn't an expensive machine but don't really want to brick it - I am super curious to know if a downgrade would make it comfortable.

    • zlhr replied to this.

      diop Don't get your hopes up.
      I had one of the older BIOS versions on my X220 and DP and VGA output were always strainy (DP used with DP to HDMI converter cable).
      As for the BIOS reflash, I already sold my X220, but I doubt it would fix anything.

      Long shot, but isn't A-FRC a type of software dithering occurring at the monitor (vs. OS/GPU)?

      Only reason I bring this up: I had used two external monitors on my zbook forever. The laptop had 6bpc depth by default on its native screen, and that carried over to the external monitors. One day, I made the mistake of setting them to 8bpc, and the nVidia control panel wouldn't let me revert! Swore I had eye strain issues thereafter.

      I swear a lot of these issues coincide with the move to 8bpc+, and a lot of monitors are not yet 8bpc native (it's 6+aFRC). I wonder if something similar happened here - defaulting to a higher color depth that forced flickering.

      I have no idea if something native to the 8 bit color "palette" is what bothers my eyes or just the flickering that gets us there, but I suspect it has something to do with that on modern software & hardware. In any case, good luck :/

      diop Yes, which is why I discount this whole "Windows 10 flashed my VBIOS" idea. I could see it putting the video card into some temporary state, but draining the battery ought to fix the issue.

      • JTL replied to this.

        Gurm I've messed up a Macbook Pro to where the internal display was flickering (like dithering but worse) when using some of my own custom methods to attempt to override low level variables in the driver, and it persisted after a reboot. Went away after holding down the command+option+shift+power for a few minutes. Scared the shit out of me.

          JTL yes, that's almost expected on a MAC since the PRAM/SMC has its own non-volatile memory (and reset methodology, as you note). PC hardware doesn't have non-volatile PRAM, any changes to the SMC should not outlast a full reset. At least, on most consumer-level hardware.

          a year later

          The topic is a bit old now, but I feel like I have the same problem.

          I was on build 1803 on my office laptop (dell latitude 5580), I never had a problem with it. I decided to try build 1809 as my IT company feels the need to make us apply the latest updates (for obvious reasons) from time to time and I knew I could come back to 1803 within 10 days anyways.

          I installed 1809 and it instantly got strainy for me. I reversed it with the W10 recovery tool and since I got back to 1803, I still feel the strain everyday, even after a 2 days break.
          I feel like something changed in the display, the brightness, the colours, I don't know what exactly. I keep on having mild eye strain and a light headache, which never happened before with this device.
          No changes in drivers apparently.
          Do anyone has an idea ?
          I'm really confused, it could be either purely psychological 😅 or some kind of "invisible" updates that don't get removed with the recovery tool ?

            SAH I had your problem when i updated from 1809 to 1909, but the recovery was enough for me to fix the problem. So I don't know how to help you.. i would try to install a clean 1909 to see if something changes!
            BTW the 1809 is fine on my latitude E5550 but not with my desktop PC (AMD 480X).

            Edit: I've seen a difference from these 2 systems. The notebook have W10 1809 with display driver 2.0 (very old) instead the desktop has W10 1809 with display driver 2.5 (the right driver of 1809, the 1903 has got the 2.6 and the 2004 2.7).
            Now I have to try to install an old versions of this display driver but I don't understand if it's something inside the GPU driver or inside the OS! I am trying 🙂

            • SAH replied to this.
            • SAH likes this.

              Not a specific solution, but if any of you can get your hands on Windows 10 Enterprise 2015 LTSB: I still think this is the way to go. It gets updates until 2025 and doesn't have the new 2016+ rendering that is especially worse for some of us. That's really the only idea I have, but it most probably will help.

                Lauda89 Thank you for your solution. I'll try to update as much as I can anyways to see if any new version is better (some said 1903 and 1909 gave them a relief...). If not, I could ask my company to use an older "system image" they have from my computer.
                What is your desktop monitor btw ? 🙂
                And where do you see these display driver versions ?
                Tell me if you achieve something with drivers

                KM Indeed, I've seen so many people here being happy with the 2015 LSTB ! I had the build 1703, 1709 and 1803 with no problems during the last couple of years, so at least I'll try to get back to such versions to see if my problem is over. As it's a computer from my IT company, I can't tweak it as much as I want. But thanks a lot for the solution 🙂

                  SAH I try to explain what I found. The WDDM is something integrated into the OS, but wich version your OS are using it depends by GPU driver. So with my desktop I have the 1809 and the WDDM of this OS is the 2.5 version. Now, I've tried to uninstall the AMD driver and reinstall an old version from 2018. Now I am using the WDDM 2.4 because this driver don't support the 2.5 or newer!
                  I don't know if it's better for my eye, I have to test it.
                  Anyway, if you want to know wich version you are using press window + R, digit dxdiag and then under the screen tab you will find the info.

                  My monitor is the Alienware AW2518H (Full HD, TN panels 240 Hz). It was super fine for me before the upgrade to the 1809 and newer driver, now I feel some eye strain. Also with the MBP 16" same thing. I have to try to format and install the old 1709 but I have a bad internet connection in this moment so I can't.

                  • SAH replied to this.
                  • KM likes this.

                    I've had some similar experiences... in that I was pretty much A-OK on Windows 10 all the way up to 1909 and a bit. Something changed a while after I updated to 1909 and I was getting eye strain. (I tried installs of Win 7 and Win 10 and they all exhibited the same problem). Then a while later the problem just went away. I've never been able to explain it.

                    True, I did get my prescription updated around the same time so that may have had something to do with it - but then I was not having any problems with my good laptop.

                    Now, my Win 10 machine is all good - and it's my good (for years!) Macbook that has gone bad. Same Macbook screens, cables etc etc and there have been NO major updates installed but it's all giving me eye strain.

                    This stuff is just utterly confounding. That said, I am a bit suspicious about my prescription and whether things have changed there - but I can't get it checked as we're in lockdown.

                      Lauda89 Interesting discovery ! So I tried dxdiag, and my HD530 is WDDM 2.1 and my 940MX driver gives me WDDM 2.4. I'll test different drivers to check if there's any difference
                      Keep me updated about your tests as well 🙂

                      AgentX20 "(I tried installs of Win 7 and Win 10 and they all exhibited the same problem)" Do you mean you tried to get back to older versions and the strain was persistant ?
                      Indeed your prescription may have an impact on it. What W10 version have you kept in the end ?

                        SAH Do you mean you tried to get back to older versions and the strain was persistant ?

                        Yes, that was my observation. Couldn't explain it for the life of me.

                        Indeed your prescription may have an impact on it. What W10 version have you kept in the end ?

                        I'm OK on the current/latest build

                        • SAH likes this.

                        NotAlone I'm not sure my problem is related to this specific dithering as I have it even deactivating my Nvidia GPU, it persists even with ditherig, and it specifically appeared during that 1809 update.
                        But if it helps some people it's good 🙂

                        6 days later

                        I think I found out about (one of) my problems. During this Windows upgrade, I was going through a stressful moment in my daily life and I felt my TMJ disorder getting way worse. I kept on using my computer (with build 1803) with mild strain. I decided to use my dental protector at night as I haven't used it so much, and tried some stuff to relax during the day.
                        I can totally use my computer again, as before...
                        So I can fairly say I found some of my triggers, stress and TMJ disorder. Maybe it prevents my eyes from working well or being aligned.
                        Thanks to all for listening and helping 🙂

                        PS : It doesn't solve my problem with all the screens though, just some that suddenly became unusable.

                          SAH Good to know you found a way to relief you aches.

                          Stress is always something which amplifies every little problem we have. It can be to make us pessimists or worse muscular problems or, in that case, sensibility for whatever causes eyestrain. By the way, what is a TMJ disorder?

                          Hey SAH, I am preparing a post with a gather of links to forums for different platforms and this way make it easy for the rest of the users here to write on each thread to make it more visible, and I need someone with Windows 10 to do it directly to windows feedback service. Could you do it? If yes, say it and I will explain every detail to you

                          • SAH replied to this.

                            TMJ is temporo-mandibular joint. It's when your jaw isn't aligned properly. I also have a dental protector and it helps at night. It looks like the same thing the basketball players wear, that transparent horseshoe which is only worn on the upper jaw. I often wake up and find my teeth embedded in it.

                              dev