So i am trying to use my Eizo EV2495 switching between

a.) My Win10 work laptop with an intel CPU and integrated GPU(native resolution on external screen)

b.) My Steam deck on Desktop mode(native resolution on external screen)

c.) AMD 6600XT + Win 10 (super resolution, without it it is unbearable, RGB limited, 8bit colors, DP)

Something is causing me nausea with the 6600XT, but not with the other 2 devices. It is like the screen is mildly shaking/vibrating. Perhaps i can get used to it, high chance my eyes are still overreacting, because they are shaking?(psychosomatic)?

But my eye strain yesterday was considerably less because of super resolution(3800x2400 instead of 1900x1200). Fonts are really easy to read(not psychosomatic), which i think helps to not think about dithering, which still is visible, but fast reading means i dont see it anymore. And the Eizo ev2495 has the smoothest backlight of all monitors i have ever tested, which helps me using normal brightness levels too.

I will share after longer usage of the 3 devices with the same monitor. Having less eye strain should result in the nausea going away at some point OR it gets worse with the 6600xt, but my work laptop/steam deck seems perfectly fine even without any tweaks. Steam Deck OS is clunky, but watching movies and using the browser for news/social media is perfectly fine. Work laptop has a horrible in built screen, but with external screen it is super easy to use and read.

Another point: the ATI 6600xt produces a somehow different picture and fonts look different, than on steam deck/work laptop/old GPU. Perhaps my eyes are trying to "catch" every pixel by "zooming in" and super resolution somehow is helping my eyes not trying it.

    hayder1983 gonna check super resolution with it too on my benq 4k.

    hayder1983 Perhaps my eyes are trying to "catch" every pixel by "zooming in" and super resolution somehow is helping my eyes not trying it.

    Is it like each eye trying to go to opposite directions when you are reading something? I got like sometime's

      hayder1983 The steam deck use an AMD APU with RDNA2 like your 6600XT so the same architecture.

      The "only difference" is the software, W10 vs steam OS.

      Did you try W11?

      WeinTrust no, it is like fonts and pictures looking fake oversharp somtimes with blinking subpixels on fonts. Edges are super hard to look at but only on my home pc. Even movies are harder to look at. Lowering sharpness on monitor settings never makes it better. my 6600xt is the only device i own that results in this symptoms. Higher brightness on native resolution makes it more visible somehow. But it is much much much better with super resolution.

      Lauda89"#p24023 No, but i intend to try it. I will do a clean install, but not sure when i will have time for that… may take a few days.

      I took they do off early and installed win11. Short version: Did a clean install, installed AMD Prodrivers, monitor drivers, icc profile, everything looks different now. Win11 accepted my Win10 serial key, didnt cost me anything. Actually even the installing tool of windows looked totally smooth, fonts very easy readable. Nothing pops out of the screen, everything is really calm. Win11 on my home PC is now even better than my work laptop. No shaking, my eyes are relaxing.

      I did change my BIOS to UEFI mode(had it on a compatibity mode before), which changed a lot of other settings too. Perhaps this was a motherboard issue/BIOS issue too? Perhaps ClearType is now different? No nausea anymore, it is really really strange.

      Did try Cyberpunk2077, but i cant spot a difference. The big difference is windows itself, browser usage, movies on browser.

      It only has been an hour of usage now, but this is a huge improvement.

      I dont use super resolution atm, everything on native resolution. 🙂

        hayder1983 Really nice! 🙂

        This weekend i will change my computer from a ryzen 1700X to a ryzen 7900X and i am pretty scared..

        I change everything except SSD and GPU so I don't have to format.

        I'll try use my actual SSD without formatting (W10 21H1) and if I'm not sick, I'll make a backup and i'll try to do a clean installation of W11 (22H2).

        Then, next year I will have to change GPU because I am stuck with RX480 for fear of being sick..

        Well do it only with a backup of your current system, but hey it seems to help.

        Perhaps the driver for the 6600xt is optimized only for Win11 and sth strange happens on Win10? I really really dont know, but it is super calm now.

        You could just buy an SSD and keep the old. That way you send it back when the upgrade fails. They are cheap now 🙂

          hayder1983
          Yea i have two SSD at home 1 980PRO e 1 860 EVO so i can try to keep the actual data (980PRO) or a new installation of W11(860EVO) without loosing my good software setup 😉

          I will let you know!

          For your information:

          Win11 is helping me alot, it feels a lot like my very old PC(RX 580, Win10 22H???) now. I am sure, there is some dithering i think, but seems like it wasnt the thing that killed my eyes all this time.

          These are my specs, perhaps sharing helps some of you:

          Win11 22H2, Mainboard in UEFI mode(before Win10 22H2, but not in UEFI mode)

          Intel i5 12400F, MSI ProB660-A DDR4, 32GB Gskill RipJaws V DDR4-3200, Asus Dual AMD Radeon RX6600XT OC Edition

          Eizo EV2495, Super Resolution(it is even better in win11), 3800x2400, RGB limited, 8bit Colors, no GPU scaling(GPU scaling is slightly altering the picture not sure it is better or worse)

          Monitor Settings: Paper, Brightness 50-60(dependant on daylight situation), 5000K, Icc used "EV2495 User 5000K G2.2.icc"

          Drivers: AMD-Software Pro Edition 22Q3-Win10-Win11, Full Installation

          Using high contrast setting "desert" in win11, which actually is eye sooting

          I did not test other monitors now, but i am so happy, that it somehow works togehter, that i will just leave it like that for some days. For some reason i can use this setup even without my glasses 🙂

          Using this Setup(6600xt, win11 22H2) for 2 days now and my worklaptop(Intel integrated GPU, win10 22H2) on external screen. I think Intel Win10 is better on my eyes, but i can not pinpoint why. My Eyestrain has gotten better with the 6600xt, by a lot, but Intel GPU is softer, dont know why. Without super resolution i still have some problems with the 6600xt, but not with the Intel.

          I think if someone would try some new Desktop PC my suggestion would be, try only Intel CPU with integrated GPU & external GPU on top, so you can switch between them, Intel GPU on Desktop and external GPU on games. My processor is like for 20€ more you could have bought it with an integrated GPU. I think there is dithering on both, but my eyes can handle it now, for some reason, it was sth else that didnt work for me.

            Switched to HDMI cable and dont ask why, but it is easier on the eyes.

            I am now also using "rgb limited" on the GPU and "rgb full" on the monitor. Peak brightness is now a lot lower, i can use a more normal contrast setting now. It looks greyish side by side to a the previous setting, but it actually helps me a lot. EDIT: It looks better on darker gamma setting, non-grayish. I am using gamma 2.4 on my monitor now and -5 birghtness in the GPU-settings.

            I didnt find another way to lower peak brighntess. I can now use my monitor in a dark room again, my eyes are triggered less.

            EDIT2: I have actually no idea why this has a so great impact on my eyes. I am sitting here without my eyes NOT reacting for some reason. I just watched the Cyberpunk2077 anime on my PC, my eyes did not flinch. I am watching friends now in completly dark room, it is pleasant. Gamma/contrast is totally screwed up, but in a good way.

            Don't watch in a completely dark room.. that's too much contrast.

            Just have some bias lighting behind the display on the far wall or whatever.. it's great for me because I have that by coincidence where I am sitting.. two sconces, but the lightswitch for them is on a dimmer behind me so I can just reach behind me and adjust the brightness to optimize it for the video on screen.

            Basically what I do is I just adjust it until the image is as 3D looking as possible.

            So, my advice is to have the correct settings on your monitor, but adjust the room's lighting, not the monitor.

              Sunspark What do you mean be 3D looking? High contrast?

              I only use ambient light at night, at day time i use daylight as much as possible. I always adjust the daylight situation, so that the screen is only a bit brighter than the rest of the room.

                12 days later

                hayder1983 Small update: A reason for my eyestrain seems to be oversaturated Colors, but also greyish colors are hard for my eyes. Reducing saturation seems wrong, increasing it seems wrong too.

                It is nearly impossible to limit color gamut, but if you use all 3 color blind modes in the AMD GPU driver on 3 of 20(my setting), most colors still look normal, but the most oversaturated colors are less saturated. And it doesnt get greyish!!! It is hard to explain, but worth a try if you have a AMD GPU.

                  6 days later

                  hayder1983 I can only tell you one thing… I would not be so sure your issues are with the graphics card. It could well be the motherboard/chipset. Before building a new PC I asked here whether people think motherboard could imapct this and overall people believed ti couldn't. But I'm not sure of it anymore.

                  I bought a similar system to yours, Gigabyte with a B660 chipset, i5-12400 (no F). And I get similar symptoms with a whole set of graphics cards that I bought and then returned until I decided to keep one of them but it is not good either. Internal graphics? Maybe feels a bit better, but far from OK either… I don't know what to believe and don't have the time to build various systems and spend hours testing each of them…

                  On the contrary there are people that have the same chipset as we do and say they observe no changes with the same graphics card… (@ludwig)

                  On the contrary I have two NVIDIA Quadro-based (T1000) laptops running Win10 21h2 (same as the PC) and they are OK for me, both using their built-in display and the same monitor as on the PC. Incredible.

                  Before this PC I tried two laptops (both Lenovo Legion 5 with 10300h i5 - one with nvidia 2060, anothe with a 1650) - both very bad.

                  I also had a pre-built PC with a 11600 i5, B560 and a 1660 TUF and it felt quite OK, but I returned it for other reasons (I probably shouldn't have).

                    machala Dont feel bad about your setup, because there is no way of knowing what you can get used to and what not. Dont feel bad about money being wasted, some people will buy cigarettes for more than 1000€ a year but we are trying to do sth beneficial to our health. 😉

                    Well it is more than one thing that strains my eye, but a bad device stays a bad device. I think my two Eizo monitors are a weapon. They are meant to be flickerfree, but they do some very fast flickering(up to 50.000 hz and more) on the background lighting settings i use(someone measured it on a recent device). Going to 100/100 brightness doesnt make it better, i tried it and always get immense back pain in the back of my eye using them(harder than any other device i ever used or tested). I also have a BenQ 32 inch that causes only mild eyestrain because no PWM at all, but causes me naseau, but it is better when i use it on a lower resolution centered in the screen(making it more or less a 24 inch screen that way).

                    My first problem is PWM. For example i am symptomfree with my 5 year old HUAWEI phone, i use it a lot. I can use it in total darkness without eye strain. I have to do this because i have to wait 10-30 Minutes until my son falls asleep. But there is a brightness setting, that the phone wont toggle down to on its own, you have to force the phone. As soon as i do this by force(put the slider all the way to the left) it is becoming straining. I am sure my eye is not liking it, because it is more flickery that way. I also have a LG TV and i can see the 120hz flicker with my bare eyes when going lower than 50/100 on SDR content. But this can all be solved, there are a lot of flickerfree DC-current monitors out there.

                    My second problem could be GPU/Mainboard/softwarerelated. I just looked at my step mums Iphone 13 and it crashes my eyes. My workphone is an Iphone X and it is not causing me symptoms. I think both are using White OLED, so this shouldnt be screen related. They Sony OLED i tested gave me super weird nausea, it is the same screen size as my old one. All picture optimizing was off, it was totally ok in the store. I still think OLED is the way to go, but perhaps i will try a LG 55B2 next, but only after i found a suitable monitor. It is impossible to test anything with a suboptimal monitor.

                    I also use up to three devices(PC, worklaptop, steam deck) with the same monitor(i now never use more than one monitor at a time, because it is too many variables). Symptoms are slighty better with the Intel, but until i have an optimal monitor i think i cannot pinpoint(flickerfree, responsive, 24 inch max, TN-Panel colors, sharpness setting to play with). I think it is about font rendering, but i am not sure.

                    My next test is the LG 24 GL600F. One of the users in the forum tried it and he never said a bad word about it again(he was active months after getting it). I also searched for people complaing about "eye strain", "strong reds", "flicker" with this monitor, but only complain seems to be with freesync, which you can turn off. It is worth a shot, it is 174€, which is like going to the restaurant 3-4 times in my country. Rtings review below.

                    https://www.rtings.com/monitor/reviews/lg/24gl600f

                    My last problem is lighting, but i use a lot of daylight and it is near impossible to find out which lighting i prefer, when i dont have a working monitor. I know that some HUE lamps seem to be bearable(hue white and color) and other HUE lamps i own are sh*tty garbage(hue white).

                    I am also thinking about getting an old monitor without LEDs inside but with an HDMI port. But my wife is killing me with her nagging about all the stuff i already bought, so will try the LG 24GL600f first.

                    If the monitor is better i will try to get a cheap used laptop with a safe GPU and a working docking station(i have one, but not sure it will fit a used laptop). Used laptops can be super cheap and i am totally fine to use PC only for gaming and a safe laptop i can do all my work stuff on.

                    You seem to not have problems with your monitor? What are you using right now?

                      hayder1983

                      I am quite convinced that the motherboard plays a significant role. I changed PC from a ryzen 1700 with X370 motherboard to a ryzen 7900 with b650 motherboard, kept the same video card (RX 480), cable and monitor and after 15 minutes I already have negative symptoms.

                      I even cloned the old SSD to try to have the same software but nothing, I keep having problems with headaches and dizziness.
                      There is to say that windows installed drivers even though I had windows update blocker on. I guess they are drivers that it has available without having to connect to the internet! It was something related with the PCI bus..

                        Lauda89 which problems did you have with the new motherboard? nausea and brainfog? But i dont get nausea with my Eizo monitor, same DP cable, same power cable, same motherboard. Not sure why it should be the motherboard?!

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