Hi again,

Some news. I recently purchased an old monitor Dell U2413 because I use something similar at work (U3014). The monitor at work causes absolutely no problems to my eyes. My work computer has a Nvidia K620 GPU and the monitor is running on DisplayPort cable. I figured I would search for a similar monitor but 24 inch. So I purchased a used U2413. The difference between U2413 and U3014 seems to be only the panel color depth. The U3014 is using 10bit and the U2413 is using 8bit+frc. Both panels are AH-IPS with GB-r LED backlight.

Anyway, on Windows 10 I don't have the red eye problem anymore. On Linux this combination works: Nvidia Quadro T600 + Dell U2413 + DVI + Nvidia drivers.

I am, however, very confused. I tried the displayport connection first. On Windows there was no problem, but on Linux it seemed that although I would get less eye discomfort, I did feel slight tingling in my eyes. Then I switched to DVI cable and the tingling was gone. I wish I knew what is going on. Maybe Linux developers should start using newer monitors and connections, maybe then they would stumble upon the same problem themselves and perhaps solve it.

Hi. Thanks for sharing. Are you still using monitors with VGA input? Is the Dell U2413 better than the VGA monitor before? Why not keep the old one?!

    hayder1983

    Hi, I am no longer using VGA on the ViewSonic monitor, nor am I using that monitor anymore. I am still using F-417 on VGA, but that is not my main monitor. I would say that for Ubuntu the ViewSonic on VGA was equally good as Dell U2413 on DVI, except that DVI has a better picture. From what I can tell, HDMI is good for the eyes as well, but I didn't have time to test it. I am using the Dell monitor at 8 bit per channel because that way I shouldn't be using FRC.

    I hope this 10+ year old monitor lasts till I retire…

      Do you have a setting for RGB Full/limited on your U2413? Most of what you write sounds like a problem with peak brightness. Via HDMI you can change this in the driver and some(not all) monitors you can also change it in the monitor.

        hayder1983

        On U2413 I use Full RGB. I can't change it on the monitor, but I could set it to Limited in the Nvidia control panel if I use HDMI. But Full RGB is ok for my eyes. But, as I said I use DVI on Ubuntu which makes my eyes feel ok. I really hope this lasts a long time.

        In general, what I found is that setting range to Limited does help a lot! Previously, with ViewSonic monitor, I used HDMI with Limited RGB and the relief on the eyes was instant. So I can confirm what you mentioned. Limited helps a lot. If you can do with a whiter image.

        But I don't know anymore what is going on. In the last two years I purchased 4 monitors and returned 3, 4 Nvidia graphics cards (2 different GT 1030, GT 730, Quadro T600), a bucket full of cables and adapters … I can't believe how much money I wasted just to be able to look at the screen. I tried so many combinations but still I cannot say what is going on. I can't even give solid advice to people with the same problem. I used to think that TN monitors would help. But they don't! Then that older Nvidia GPU would help. Well, I don't really know. I have a very old 8400 GS and on DVI I get the same result as on Quadro T600 with a mDP->DVI adapter. Both on Ubuntu and Windows 10. A very old ATI FireGL also didn't make a difference.

            brjdenis In June i changed my setup, i was able to do everything for 10-14 hours at my old setup, now i am happy to do my work for 8 hours without super hard pain. I have now 4 monitors, but it all didnt help. Getting back my old GPU back is impossible and buying a "new old" is super expensive for some reason(200+€ for old GPUs…). I used an old AMD card, which was super ok in combination with my 14 y old LG TN Panel(contrast setting was low).

            New monitors are so superbright in peak. White is like a knife in my eyes. Old monitor is giving me nausea but it white is much smoother. I chose the new monitor, because nausea is even worse for me than eye pain. I now with the help of what i learned on this forum able to work 8h and watch TV again(RGB limited, super resolution). My worklaptop is usable even without these workarounds.

            I think manufacterers may do some stuff, that is stressful to the eyes, but they dont know it is stressful, like compression of videosignals or agressive dithering. They dont know, because most people wont notice the difference. GPUs are clearly doing something very different than from 5 years ago.

                hayder1983

                In regard to brightness, I agree that modern monitors are way too bright. The U2413 has 350cd/m2 at 100% brightness and about 120 cd/m2 at 20% which is still too bright for me. I usually need below 100 cd/m2. And I don't work in a dark room. And monitors are always calibrated at some very high brightness, so if you use very low brightness you get a bad picture. I searched for "low brightness" monitors, but I didn't find anything good.

                My opinion on manufacturers. I know there is a petition out on this page to signal the manufacturers that some people have problems with eye strain. The problem I see is that it is impossible for regular users to define the technical cause. The only solution I see is: we either categorize types of eye/head problems and draw up a list of acceptable monitors/GPUs etc. or we wait till developers modernize their desktops and hopefully stumble upon this issue themselves.

                    brjdenis eizo Monitors go down to 1 cd/m2. I have an eizo ev2460 and an eizo ev2495. I use the ev2495 at 30-40 cd/m2. Its still too bright sometimes but it can go lower. Perhaps you can find a used one without White LED? They arent cheap but good. Prad.de tested alot of them. It is german but autotranslate…

                    Down below brightness for my ev2495

                      brjdenis thing is i dont know what my symptom are. Win10+6600xt+ev2495 nausea. Win11 elimated the nausea. But what did give me nausea? Driver Problem? Is win11 rendering different. At the same time win10 on my wotklaptop with ev2495 as external screen is nauseafree & white is less stressful. Pwm seems to be ok for my eyes, but dithering is like ants in my eyes.

                      I have bought and returned 15 Devices. Sony OLED i returned but Amazon didnt pay me back… i am sure are checking my history 🙂

                      Manufacterers only test things they can measure, like contrast or flicker. Dont think they will start measuring eye health or brain issues. 😃

                          hayder1983

                          Windows 11 is not causing problems for you? I was thinking of upgrading to Windows 10, but it may be better for me to purchase Windows 11 license and do the installation from scratch.

                          Do you have the feeling that Windows 11 is less irritating for the eyes than Windows 10? Was is just nausea or did you have red eyes as well, that is burning sensation, dryness etc.?

                              brjdenis but it may be better for me to purchase Windows 11 license and do the installation from scratch.

                              If you just want to try Windows 11, you don't need to pay, it can be used indefinitely without buying a license -- there are some limitations around personalization but it should be good enough to see if it causes eyestrain.

                                brjdenis Yes win11 is less irritating to my eyes. I did the installation with my win10 cd key. I had: Nausea, dizziness, diarrhea, red eye, Pain in the back of my eye(like a cramp), my eyes started twitching of every source of light, i used eyedrops 5 times a day and it still was very dry.

                                Now i have normal eyestrain, using eyedrops 2-3 times a day. Still not perfect, but much much better. No nausea and no diarrhea.

                                You can install without a key and just test it for a few days. With an usb stick it is a very fast installation 😉

                                  3 months later

                                  An update. I got my hands on a used monitor, HP LP2475w. And it works great with Linux (Pop!_OS) and Nvidia GT 1030 on DVI cable. No eye strain (no red eyes).

                                  These combinations are also fine:

                                  • GT 730 + DVI + Linux/Windows 10
                                  • GT 1030 + DP + Windows 10
                                  • Nvidia T600 + DP + Windows 10

                                  For some reason, Nvidia T600 is great with DP + Windows 10, but not with Linux, not even with DP->DVI adapter.

                                  This monitor has an 8 bit panel, and should work well with GT 1030. And it also has CCFL backlighting which I know is better for my eyes than LED. The only drawback is perhaps that brightness 0 is still too bright for a dark room.

                                    No need to get a 11 key. I've used the same 7 key on 10 and 11 on the same machine.

                                    4 months later

                                    brjdenis
                                    I have same problem "eye strain" on modern monitors as you mentioned in. So, i am trying to seek best monitor for eye care. I noticed that you emphasized Dell U2413 has no problem for eyes. Do you recommend it? howewer i see that monitor is too bright 350 cd/m².Isnt it problem?

                                        Fakir35 Hi, there are combinations with GPU and this monitor that don't work. I really don't know if I can recommend it. I tried so many different combinations and nothing is really perfect. I don't know. And yes, the monitor is bright which is something I don't like. Take into account that it is not only the monitor, but also the GPU that causes eye strain, burning etc.

                                            brjdenis

                                            Thank you for your feedback. I used combination with AMD Radeon 6600 with Asus VG249Q1A (IPS) also Benq Zowie XL2411K (TN), for both of them,results were horrific. Both of monitors caused me burning eyes and eye sting in after looking 15-20 minutes. Besides any problem of i could not find not much a user complaint (maybe i couldnt search many platform) till i discovered this site (at least i feel i'm not alone 🙂). I dunno know how many monitors should i try?
                                            However, i used my laptop (casper excalibur g650) which screen size 15.6 inch, brightness level is 300 cd/m², coated with antiglare on screen, (IPS Panel) and GPU, GTX 1050 for 4 years. There was no problem with eyes while i spent time more than few hours. But now i can not look more than 15-20 minutes?? and which item cause it? Displays or GPU's?

                                                Fakir35 In my experience it's graphics drivers. There are many configurations which are comfortable for me on Win10/11, but Linux is a no-go. Using XCFE (without a compositor) helps and is usable for me but not nearly as comfortable as Windows.

                                                I can dual boot, use Win11 for many hours, then when I switch to, say, gnome or KDE on the same hardware, my eyes start burning in 20 minutes or so and the effects last a day.

                                                    dev