you want high blue light when you're on CCFL, or stuff like HID lamp projectors

that's probably the last 20% for you. I mean there are papers from the 60s of people getting eyestrain when they work under sodium vapor lighting or dark rooms, or purposely induced eye strain in studies with amber filter sunglasses or reading on orange reddish print paper.

blue light is only a problem when its emitted by LEDs that have an unnatural polar radiation pattern (flat planar emittance). light in nature is either blackbody (the sun, candle, filament bulbs) or fluorescence (firefly, coral reefs, HID and CCFL) that have a diverging 360 degree radiation pattern from the source. blue light bends the most so its the most sensitive to directionality (see plus and minus lenses and chromatic aberration)

blue light is used to treat brain fog and fatigue and has been for a very long time. blue tinted glasses and irlen lenses, syntonics etc. osram and phillips made 8000/12000/16000k tubes to boost mood and productivity as well as stimulate cognition in the elderly. the reason they stopped is because they know it won't work as well with LEDs as well as the current narrative surrounding blue light

so crank up that blue light and stop wearing blockers and enjoy the CCFL. you're also likely someone who suffers from 'accommodative lead' related physical eyestrain. LED light doesn't stimulate accommodation well, which is the reason why phoropter machines for refraction all use halogen light sources. in fact LED light is actually relaxing for someone who has the opposite type of eye strain called 'accommodative lag'.

ps: feeling better when you're further from the screen means that the PPI is likely too low for you up close to stimulate accommodation (spatial frequency stimulates the eyes to focus). maybe try a smaller p2211h or even 12/15" laptops.

personally I use a custom CCFL thinkpad with modern parts, have a stockpile of AW2310's and use blue filtered halogen or 14/20k metal halides for general illumination to really get into the zone at my workstation

you can also try lowering the sharpness setting and also reducing the amount of red light in your custom RGB settings. if I'm not mistaken there's quite a large spike due to the type of red phosphors used

DisplaysShouldNotBeTVs

it's probably the shit auo TN viewing angles that makes it comfortable because it simulates positive spherical aberration where the center is brighter/in focus compared to the peripheral which allows the eye to generate micro saccadic motions to scan the entire screen rather then having to strain and move the eyes themselves which happens with a wide viewing angle IPS/OLED. the 'perfect viewing angles' makes you lose the contrast in depth between focal and peripheral. remember, concave and flat surfaces rarely exist in nature, the human face is spherical etc

I can tolerate the latest 540hz AUO TNs cause the viewing angle is so shit. I can also semi tolerate oleds if I wear a multifocal contact (coopervision misight) that has a pinhole design.

have you viewed a convex commercial display monitor in person before? it has the same effect but even better

ps: (Whereas on "bad" screens, it is painful to look at any part of the screen where there is "complex information-dense content" or a "large blurry/stretched/distorted image", and the "painful areas" actually change depending on the onscreen content. That LG IPS I was "initially optimistic about" failed because it had this issue). sounds like textbook accommodative lead where the person can only 'scan' rather then 'read' since the eyes are 'stuck' due to lack of light stimulus

    13 days later

    @evthelegend @jordan

    FYI — I bought a second AUO303E panel that was manufactured in "18th week of 2018" instead of "29th week of 2015" like my first one. The 2018 one is different.

    The 2015 one is still working very well for me on Windows 10 with Basic Display Adapter for a few weeks now (at this point I've entirely switched to it as my main display!)

    However, the 2018 AUO303E (which I tried on the exact same computer) has slightly more "intense" colors to my eyes, the sense of motion/response times feels "floaty" while scrolling and sometimes makes me dizzy (which isn't an issue at ALL on the 2015 one!!) and I had to be very close to it in order to read small print -- unlike the 2015 AUO303E where I can read very clearly at a distance.

    So there's definitely something wrong with the 2018 version. I felt kind of spaced out/disoriented after using it for a while and the shadows around windows looked way more intense or "contrast enhanced"…

    I returned to the "2015 version", and it has none of those issues (and remains one of the best panels I've found to this day!!)

    But (surprisingly) I can't recommend the "2018 version". The 2018 panel feels like a totally different LCD despite having same H/W F/W numbers and same panel ID.

    If you want to try this panel, I still heavily recommend based on my great experience with the first one I bought!

    However, you should ensure you are buying a version manufactured [at or before 15/29] based on the sticker -- and that you can return it if needed (e.g. to try another one from a different year).

    Both are "H/W 6A" and "F/W 1".

      5 days later

      reaganry Nope. The 2015 version of AUO303E is still working great though. One of the best screens I've ever used, I knew there was something "different" about it the first time it powered on.

      And it got even better than it already was, after disabling Intel drivers, using ditherig.exe, setting it to 100% backlight and 40hz mode (important!), and using NegativeScreen to fix the "TN white color" issue as I mentioned earlier. Set the backlight and framerate by toggling drivers on, making the changes, then toggling back off.

      And, unexpectedly, even better yet again when dual booting into 2015 LTSB to avoid the "composition layers" issues that started with 1607 (I use 2015 LTSB as a "thin client" OS basically since I only have NoMachine and RealVNC installed on it).

      There was a very subtle "mesh pattern" I noticed on the screen while running newer versions even with Basic Display, especially on solid color backgrounds, that vanished on 2015 LTSB. It was something caused by Windows, different from dithering (since it's not visible on 2015 LTSB even when dithering is set to Spatial).

      I reboot back into the newer Windows when I'm outdoors and want to use it as a standalone laptop.

      Note that even on my initial setup (newer Windows version, Intel drivers disabled) it's still leagues ahead of other screens and is still "as good as when I started", but since I'm committed to "achieving the most comfortable laptop screen possible", I took it even further and it was able to get even better than that! I already knew it was great when I first got it though.

      (However, avoid native Linux, I have NO idea how it does it, but it somehow makes this otherwise fine screen cause strain. There is some weird "contrast enhancement"-like effect that I can notice. The workaround is running a Linux VM within Windows, which works great.)

      I kind of use it as "a monitor" since I'm using NoMachine on the T480 to remotely use/view a macOS machine without any strain.

      But no, I haven't found any dedicated external monitors that are as good as this (including the 4 old CCFL TNs I own! even the oldest external monitor I have, from 2005, although "kinda" better than a typical modern screen, still causes some strain for me even if connected to "safe hardware")

      Note that the "manufactured 2018" variant of AUO303E causes issues even when running with all of these tweaks AKA it has some sort of panel-level issue. Returned that one

      It's specifically the "manufactured 2015" AUO303E that's this good

          7 days later
          a month later

          Just one update: even though all my positives about the AUO303E panel still hold true, I actually ended up swapping it for the earlier AUO 1366x768 panel I also discussed: B140XTN02.D (also manufactured 2015)

          Initially, I thought the 900p one was better, bu the 768p is actually even more comfortable to me!

          The pixel inversion is far less noticeable, and since it's glossy it doesn't have the rainbow/graininess issue that the 900p did (which had a pretty subpar matte coating). Black text contrast is better (in a good way — not too intense)

          (It it a little bit worse "color accuracy wise" but that doesn't matter to me)

          Also discovered that for both panels, running at 40fps feels even more comfy compared to 60fps

          So now I'd say the AUO B140XTN02.D is my top recommendation 🙂

          I have a colleague who started wearing blue light glasses (the really conspicuous ones with visible rose tinting) over the last month and it's apparently been a game-changer for her.

            Again I have no association with them, but I too have serious eye problems when I use modern LCD displays. So I can use CRT displays !

            What about these glasses from ZEPTER distributor, and test a pair of

            Fullerene C60 doped glasses lenses. Make sure to choose indoor lighter color version.

            https://shop.zepter.com/Medical/smart-glasses/HYPERLIGHT-OPTICS-SET,-INDOOR-LENSES

            I wonder if they remove the flicker? The price is 180Eur if you manage to get good discount. But only if it works as claimed. Perhaps these could remove the dithering too.

              one bad news! All of a sudden my good setup (M1 Macbook + CCFL Dell U2410 + Blue light blocking Amber glass) is giving me neck pain and eye strains. I was using this for last 12 months without any issues.

              What changed?

              My work laptop Macbook Pro M1 recently updated to 15.2 (Sequoia). Ever since this update, I am facing this issue.

              Previously it was macOS Sonoma. It was good and no issues with the setup - Dell u2410 + Amber glasses.

              What's next?

              Play with different settings and find optimum one.

              Update -> My issue got fixed now. It was due to 5Ghz new wifi connection. Moved back to 2.4Ghz wifi connection. My issues got resolved.

                5 days later

                karthi3219 Interesting, so I guess it got even worse, because for me on Ventura 13.6.6 even with known-good monitors, if I connect my M1 Air to them (instead of e.g. an intel graphics Windows PC which is totally fine) they suddenly start causing strain.

                I even notice weird artifacts + ghosting-like image persistence when a Mac is connected, most visible on older LCD monitors that have slow response times which makes this obvious (horizontal lines that appear while scrolling and slowly fade out) that isn't present with an Intel Windows PC connected. This remains even after activating Stillcolor.

                Since I already know that M1 Mac display output has been messed up since at least Ventura, probably earlier, I wonder what they changed in Sequoia that managed to make it even worse?

                  DannyD2

                  For me, most blue light glasses don't work at all (for screens). However, there's one that actually works for me — these specific ones that are "pure red" and essentially function as "monochrome mode for the real world".

                  Ignore their marketing, I swear the page changes title every few months lol — the first time I personally learned about these was during a vision appointment where they happened to have a pair. I'm recommending this purely based on their functional properties and my experience using them for 2 years. Haven't found another brand that makes this specific shade of deep red, most lean more towards orange or "purplish" red in my testing.

                  While wearing them, almost everything becomes red or orange (except a few shades of teal).

                  Some screens that are otherwise unusable become much more tolerable for me with these (but as always, keep in mind that this is not a "fix"). Usually blue light glasses don't change screens at all for me so this is really unique. I use them all the time whenever I need to use devices I have issues with. They also seem to reduce my flicker sensitivity.

                  Still works just as well as when I got them 2 years ago.

                  I also use them with my good devices too, at night, instead of using a software filter. Even if the screen is already good I find that it creates a relaxing effect, due to how it makes everything "physically" monochrome.

                  Specifically the pure red one in the link has this effect. I also tried some of the other colors offered (like orange) but they didn't do anything for me. So there's probably something about this pure red that filters out something in the screen's light output?

                    @DisplaysShouldNotBeTVs Hey update! It was not recent MacOS update that was unexpectedly given me eye strain. It was my new 5G wi-fi router connection. I have moved back to previous 2.4Ghz Wifi connection and all my symtoms disappeared. I am continue to use my existing setup. M1 Macbook + Dell U2410 CCFL monitor + Blue light blocking AMBER glasses.

                    I shared this in a new thread - https://ledstrain.org/d/3146-another-parameter-to-headaches-eye-strain-5g-networks

                    dev