Exciting! I'm wondering if we can find a similar solution for the 24-27 inch format perhaps I could just combine multiples of these AUO panels together. The last monitor driver board I used still caused strain for me.
screen-Induced Brain Fog & Eyestrain – CCFL + Blue Light Glasses Seem to Help
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photon78s Yep I've been using it even longer today, many hours straight, and I think it's safe to say at this point that the AUO 303E (2015, H/W 6A, F/W 1) is even more comfortable than my old "safe screen". Honestly one of the most comfortable screens I've used.
I've been reading tons of stuff on here and it feels so paper-like
Can move my eyes to all corners of the screen and I haven't been feeling any "friction" or "scratchiness" in the movement, it's so smooth
And when I scroll it doesn't feel like my eyes are being "pulled" by the motion of the scrolling -- my eyes just stay right in the center of the screen and the scrolling happens "around" it, and I don't feel dizzy
Also, when there are many contrasting items on screen, like a dark gray dialog with washed-out gray text, opening in front of a blue window with white text, with a light mode window on the side, I don't feel overwhelmed, they somehow do not "clash" with each other and I can focus on all of them comfortably at the same time
Not even my safe screen was perfect with this, so I am super impressed by this panel
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Been trying 50% backlight on AUO303E now for a few hours (AKA default backlight when booted without Intel drivers, before using the workaround where you quickly toggle drivers on/off to get 100% backlight with Basic Display)
Also good. Still continues to impress me compared to 90% of screens I've used
I slightly prefer 100% backlight + software dimmer for reading (text is still way more than comfortable enough to read at 50% too), but it's good to know that 50% also works too. Since there's some times I prefer the lower hardware backlight, like when working in "black background" apps to reduce the "gray" tint of black
Interestingly, even though the screen has "mild" PWM (even at max backlight, but mild enough to not affect me at all), the intensity of the flicker on camera doesn't seem to increase much at 50% backlight?
So there's probably something different about the PWM method here that makes it not bother me, because yeah IMO the presence of flicker doesn't matter here
This screen is the first time I've ever been able to comfortably move on from my old laptop for entire days of work AND legitimately feels better to read than my old laptop
6 days later
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1 week update:
AUO B140RTN03.0 + ThinkPad T480 (UHD 620) + ditherig + Basic Display Driver is still working great!
I've been able to transfer my general workflow (schoolwork, note-taking, writing a few longer documents, some photo editing, web browsing, responding to emails, texting, reading long PDFs & articles, music production, watching long videos, NoMachine to remotely use Mac apps) from my old "safe screen" to this LCD very smoothly.
I'm consistently NOT getting strained!
I literally haven't touched my old laptop in a week. First time I've EVER been able to say this.
The only thing I haven't tried yet is long coding sessions, but I've edited some small code files and it felt nice.
Edit: tried coding on it now (via NoMachine into an M1 Mac) and it's also very comfy. With colorful highlighting too! Only thing I had to "go out of my way" for was modifying my editor theme to increase contrast since it's a TN. If someone wants the VSCode appearance settings I'm using let me know!
In fact there is even an improvement for anything involving motion (scrolling is way better and doesn't cause any dizziness on this screen) and any images with high contrast/"strange perspectives" (which don't cause any weird "additional" strain, which was still actually somewhat of an issue on my old safe screen).
@jordan @photon78s Since I wasn't able to find an second identical safe laptop with the same screen, I actually recommend this screen more now, as it seems much more likely to be reproducible + is better in some ways!
The only noticeable flaws IMO are:
pixel inversion: it's sometimes visible, especially in the top right corner for some reason, but I can read text totally fine on this panel so I don't think it's much of an issue. However, sometimes flickering can be seen in dense line/checkerboard patterns. (Overall though, I experience much LESS "pattern glare" on this LCD compared to most screens, so "stronger than usual pixel inversion" here is an OK compromise IMO).
TN white color: I've noticed that with (all??) TNs, the very brightest shades of white are treated differently than other colors -- if you look at the screen from above, they uniquely "invert" to a strange "blue" shade instead of just washing out like other grays. I've noticed that these whites appear more red and more "harsh" compared to other colors.
Fortunately, there is a precise "cutoff point" where the "weird" whites instantly become "normal" when slightly dimmed. The workaround is software dimming, e.g. with NegativeScreen app. (My favorite color adjustment app since it avoids possible "side effects" of color profiles by using Windows Magnification API instead).
100% backlight is better: Although it's not bad at all at 50% (default backlight on boot) I did notice a slight headache each time I tried 50% that simply doesn't happen if I switch to 100%. Doesn't change based on content onscreen, so probably PWM-related. (Interestingly, camera still detects mild flicker at 100%, but in that case the depth is small enough to not "feel"/bother me at all and IMO shouldn't be a dealbreaker for most.)
I can only confirm it's comfortable with Basic Display Driver. (The only time I enable Intel is a quick toggle on/off to raise backlight to 100% after reboots) — YMMV whether it stays good or not with Intel UHD drivers enabled — I won't be testing this
Here are custom NegativeScreen presets I created to prevent the TN white color issue:
TN-Dim=
{ 0.9, 0, 0, 0, 0 }
{ 0, 0.9, 0, 0, 0 }
{ 0, 0, 0.9, 0, 0 }
{ 0, 0, 0, 1, 0 }
{ 0, 0, 0, 0, 1 }
TN-MoreDim=
{ 0.8, 0, 0, 0, 0 }
{ 0, 0.8, 0, 0, 0 }
{ 0, 0, 0.8, 0, 0 }
{ 0, 0, 0, 1, 0 }
{ 0, 0, 0, 0, 1 }
TN-ExtraDim=
{ 0.6, 0, 0, 0, 0 }
{ 0, 0.6, 0, 0, 0 }
{ 0, 0, 0.6, 0, 0 }
{ 0, 0, 0, 1, 0 }
{ 0, 0, 0, 0, 1 }
TN-Dim-Grayscale=
{ 0.3, 0.3, 0.3, 0, 0 }
{ 0.3, 0.3, 0.3, 0, 0 }
{ 0.3, 0.3, 0.3, 0, 0 }
{ 0, 0, 0, 1, 0 }
{ 0, 0, 0, 0, 1 }
TN-MoreDim-Grayscale=
{ 0.266, 0.266, 0.266, 0, 0 }
{ 0.266, 0.266, 0.266, 0, 0 }
{ 0.266, 0.266, 0.266, 0, 0 }
{ 0, 0, 0, 1, 0 }
{ 0, 0, 0, 0, 1 }
TN-ExtraDim-Grayscale=
{ 0.2, 0.2, 0.2, 0.0, 0.0 }
{ 0.2, 0.2, 0.2, 0.0, 0.0 }
{ 0.2, 0.2, 0.2, 0.0, 0.0 }
{ 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0 }
{ 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0 }
TN-Dim-Red=
{ 0.3, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0 }
{ 0.6, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0 }
{ 0.1, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0 }
{ 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0 }
{ -0.15, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0 }
TN-MoreDim-Red=
{ 0.3, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0 }
{ 0.6, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0 }
{ 0.1, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0 }
{ 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0 }
{ -0.25, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0 }
TN-ExtraDim-Red-LowContrast=
{ 0.25, 0, 0, 0.0, 0.0 }
{ 0.25, 0, 0, 0.0, 0.0 }
{ 0.25, 0, 0, 0.0, 0.0 }
{ 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0 }
{ 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0 }^ I usually hover around the "MoreDim" and "ExtraDim" presets depending on time of day.
The "red" variants are really useful when I'm reading/writing text for hours, since they eliminate subpixels, giving a true "physically grayscale" screen
P.S. I'm using Firefox 115.12.0 ESR on Windows (ClearType enabled with default settings). Using latest Chrome on the Mac NoMachine server (Mac font smoothing disabled). IMO these combos = best text rendering per each platform
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Yes, please. Ideally portable but not deal breaking. I know their is a 22 inch 2k portable monitor form uperfect but of unknown panel details. As you know, I've tested multiple monitors and panels over the past year but lost almost everything in listed in that discussion due to a lithium battery fire (very bad stuff) but that is off-topic on this forum. So I'm basically starting fresh.
you want high blue light when you're on CCFL, or stuff like HID lamp projectors
that's probably the last 20% for you. I mean there are papers from the 60s of people getting eyestrain when they work under sodium vapor lighting or dark rooms, or purposely induced eye strain in studies with amber filter sunglasses or reading on orange reddish print paper.
blue light is only a problem when its emitted by LEDs that have an unnatural polar radiation pattern (flat planar emittance). light in nature is either blackbody (the sun, candle, filament bulbs) or fluorescence (firefly, coral reefs, HID and CCFL) that have a diverging 360 degree radiation pattern from the source. blue light bends the most so its the most sensitive to directionality (see plus and minus lenses and chromatic aberration)
blue light is used to treat brain fog and fatigue and has been for a very long time. blue tinted glasses and irlen lenses, syntonics etc. osram and phillips made 8000/12000/16000k tubes to boost mood and productivity as well as stimulate cognition in the elderly. the reason they stopped is because they know it won't work as well with LEDs as well as the current narrative surrounding blue light
so crank up that blue light and stop wearing blockers and enjoy the CCFL. you're also likely someone who suffers from 'accommodative lead' related physical eyestrain. LED light doesn't stimulate accommodation well, which is the reason why phoropter machines for refraction all use halogen light sources. in fact LED light is actually relaxing for someone who has the opposite type of eye strain called 'accommodative lag'.
ps: feeling better when you're further from the screen means that the PPI is likely too low for you up close to stimulate accommodation (spatial frequency stimulates the eyes to focus). maybe try a smaller p2211h or even 12/15" laptops.
personally I use a custom CCFL thinkpad with modern parts, have a stockpile of AW2310's and use blue filtered halogen or 14/20k metal halides for general illumination to really get into the zone at my workstation
you can also try lowering the sharpness setting and also reducing the amount of red light in your custom RGB settings. if I'm not mistaken there's quite a large spike due to the type of red phosphors used
it's probably the shit auo TN viewing angles that makes it comfortable because it simulates positive spherical aberration where the center is brighter/in focus compared to the peripheral which allows the eye to generate micro saccadic motions to scan the entire screen rather then having to strain and move the eyes themselves which happens with a wide viewing angle IPS/OLED. the 'perfect viewing angles' makes you lose the contrast in depth between focal and peripheral. remember, concave and flat surfaces rarely exist in nature, the human face is spherical etc
I can tolerate the latest 540hz AUO TNs cause the viewing angle is so shit. I can also semi tolerate oleds if I wear a multifocal contact (coopervision misight) that has a pinhole design.
have you viewed a convex commercial display monitor in person before? it has the same effect but even better
ps: (Whereas on "bad" screens, it is painful to look at any part of the screen where there is "complex information-dense content" or a "large blurry/stretched/distorted image", and the "painful areas" actually change depending on the onscreen content. That LG IPS I was "initially optimistic about" failed because it had this issue). sounds like textbook accommodative lead where the person can only 'scan' rather then 'read' since the eyes are 'stuck' due to lack of light stimulus
13 days later
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FYI — I bought a second AUO303E panel that was manufactured in "18th week of 2018" instead of "29th week of 2015" like my first one. The 2018 one is different.
The 2015 one is still working very well for me on Windows 10 with Basic Display Adapter for a few weeks now (at this point I've entirely switched to it as my main display!)
However, the 2018 AUO303E (which I tried on the exact same computer) has slightly more "intense" colors to my eyes, the sense of motion/response times feels "floaty" while scrolling and sometimes makes me dizzy (which isn't an issue at ALL on the 2015 one!!) and I had to be very close to it in order to read small print -- unlike the 2015 AUO303E where I can read very clearly at a distance.
So there's definitely something wrong with the 2018 version. I felt kind of spaced out/disoriented after using it for a while and the shadows around windows looked way more intense or "contrast enhanced"…
I returned to the "2015 version", and it has none of those issues (and remains one of the best panels I've found to this day!!)
But (surprisingly) I can't recommend the "2018 version". The 2018 panel feels like a totally different LCD despite having same H/W F/W numbers and same panel ID.
If you want to try this panel, I still heavily recommend based on my great experience with the first one I bought!
However, you should ensure you are buying a version manufactured [at or before 15/29] based on the sticker -- and that you can return it if needed (e.g. to try another one from a different year).
Both are "H/W 6A" and "F/W 1".
5 days later
DisplaysShouldNotBeTVs have you found an external monitor that feels as good as your AUO?
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reaganry Nope. The 2015 version of AUO303E is still working great though. One of the best screens I've ever used, I knew there was something "different" about it the first time it powered on.
And it got even better than it already was, after disabling Intel drivers, using ditherig.exe, setting it to 100% backlight and 40hz mode (important!), and using NegativeScreen to fix the "TN white color" issue as I mentioned earlier. Set the backlight and framerate by toggling drivers on, making the changes, then toggling back off.
And, unexpectedly, even better yet again when dual booting into 2015 LTSB to avoid the "composition layers" issues that started with 1607 (I use 2015 LTSB as a "thin client" OS basically since I only have NoMachine and RealVNC installed on it).
There was a very subtle "mesh pattern" I noticed on the screen while running newer versions even with Basic Display, especially on solid color backgrounds, that vanished on 2015 LTSB. It was something caused by Windows, different from dithering (since it's not visible on 2015 LTSB even when dithering is set to Spatial).
I reboot back into the newer Windows when I'm outdoors and want to use it as a standalone laptop.
Note that even on my initial setup (newer Windows version, Intel drivers disabled) it's still leagues ahead of other screens and is still "as good as when I started", but since I'm committed to "achieving the most comfortable laptop screen possible", I took it even further and it was able to get even better than that! I already knew it was great when I first got it though.
(However, avoid native Linux, I have NO idea how it does it, but it somehow makes this otherwise fine screen cause strain. There is some weird "contrast enhancement"-like effect that I can notice. The workaround is running a Linux VM within Windows, which works great.)
I kind of use it as "a monitor" since I'm using NoMachine on the T480 to remotely use/view a macOS machine without any strain.
But no, I haven't found any dedicated external monitors that are as good as this (including the 4 old CCFL TNs I own! even the oldest external monitor I have, from 2005, although "kinda" better than a typical modern screen, still causes some strain for me even if connected to "safe hardware")
Note that the "manufactured 2018" variant of AUO303E causes issues even when running with all of these tweaks AKA it has some sort of panel-level issue. Returned that one
It's specifically the "manufactured 2015" AUO303E that's this good
7 days later
DisplaysShouldNotBeTVs maybe you could build a couple more of your rigs and sell them to us 
a month later
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Just one update: even though all my positives about the AUO303E panel still hold true, I actually ended up swapping it for the earlier AUO 1366x768 panel I also discussed: B140XTN02.D (also manufactured 2015)
Initially, I thought the 900p one was better, bu the 768p is actually even more comfortable to me!
The pixel inversion is far less noticeable, and since it's glossy it doesn't have the rainbow/graininess issue that the 900p did (which had a pretty subpar matte coating). Black text contrast is better (in a good way — not too intense)
(It it a little bit worse "color accuracy wise" but that doesn't matter to me)
Also discovered that for both panels, running at 40fps feels even more comfy compared to 60fps
So now I'd say the AUO B140XTN02.D is my top recommendation
I have a colleague who started wearing blue light glasses (the really conspicuous ones with visible rose tinting) over the last month and it's apparently been a game-changer for her.
Again I have no association with them, but I too have serious eye problems when I use modern LCD displays. So I can use CRT displays !
What about these glasses from ZEPTER distributor, and test a pair of
Fullerene C60 doped glasses lenses. Make sure to choose indoor lighter color version.
https://shop.zepter.com/Medical/smart-glasses/HYPERLIGHT-OPTICS-SET,-INDOOR-LENSES
I wonder if they remove the flicker? The price is 180Eur if you manage to get good discount. But only if it works as claimed. Perhaps these could remove the dithering too.
I came accross this dude on the youtubes, he suggests some of the interesting supplements for the eyes,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6m4HzHiFak
These are the supplements:
Lutein
Zeaxanthin
Astaxanthin
smilem link doesn't work
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one bad news! All of a sudden my good setup (M1 Macbook + CCFL Dell U2410 + Blue light blocking Amber glass) is giving me neck pain and eye strains. I was using this for last 12 months without any issues.
What changed?
My work laptop Macbook Pro M1 recently updated to 15.2 (Sequoia). Ever since this update, I am facing this issue.
Previously it was macOS Sonoma. It was good and no issues with the setup - Dell u2410 + Amber glasses.
What's next?
Play with different settings and find optimum one.
Update -> My issue got fixed now. It was due to 5Ghz new wifi connection. Moved back to 2.4Ghz wifi connection. My issues got resolved.
5 days later
karthi3219 Interesting, so I guess it got even worse, because for me on Ventura 13.6.6 even with known-good monitors, if I connect my M1 Air to them (instead of e.g. an intel graphics Windows PC which is totally fine) they suddenly start causing strain.
I even notice weird artifacts + ghosting-like image persistence when a Mac is connected, most visible on older LCD monitors that have slow response times which makes this obvious (horizontal lines that appear while scrolling and slowly fade out) that isn't present with an Intel Windows PC connected. This remains even after activating Stillcolor.
Since I already know that M1 Mac display output has been messed up since at least Ventura, probably earlier, I wonder what they changed in Sequoia that managed to make it even worse?